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How George W. Bush Redefined American Freedom
Campaign for Liberty ^ | 2009-12-24 | James Bovard

Posted on 12/24/2009 5:02:20 PM PST by rabscuttle385

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To: rabscuttle385
James Madison, the father of the Constitution, warned in 1795, "Of all enemies to public liberty war is, perhaps, the most to be dreaded because it comprises and develops the germ of every other."

Most to be dreaded, but not always possible to avoid, as Jemmy had that pesky little matter with the British to deal with.
Madison was brilliant, yet he and the other Founders weren't perfect. Instituting an amendment process to the Constitution is evidence of their own realization that they were mere mortals who didn't possess a crystal ball to see into the future.

Dubya deserves censure on a number of things, (NCLB, prescription drugs, bailout #1) but in the WOT he took the fight to the enemy. An enemy that may very well acquire in the future the means to launch nukes or bio-weapons inside our borders.

I wonder if he were alive and POTUS on Sept 11, 2001 what Jemmy Madison would have done?

81 posted on 12/24/2009 7:26:09 PM PST by jla ("Free Republic is Palin Country" - JimRob)
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To: Bokababe
Who are the Chinese going to sell their cheap plastic schlock to if they call our note? Who will the Russians and Saudis sell their oil and gas to? And how will they “invade” the United States?
82 posted on 12/24/2009 7:30:07 PM PST by 2ndDivisionVet (I will raise $2 million for Sarah Palin: What will you do?)
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To: DakotaRed
"Defending our nation isn’t interventionism, whether Paul likes it or not."

If you think that what is going on is really about "defending America" then you are more deluded than I thought. Because open borders, paying for other country's defense around the world while neglecting our own, destroying our economy, destroying our rights as citizens, supporting globalist financiers and bailing our Wall Street (which Bush began before Obama) ISN"T DEFENDING AMERICA -- it's selling her down the river for 10 pieces of silver! And anyone who thinks that they owe Bush "a thank you" for that isn't just a Republican -- they are an idiot!

83 posted on 12/24/2009 7:31:47 PM PST by Bokababe (Save Christian Kosovo! http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: DakotaRed

My appologies. Not trying to agitate. True, I am not a Republican... not after McCain (dang, that reminds me, I still need to scrape that bumber sticker off) and pondering the legacy of Republicans as well as Democrats. Nay, I am an American. I am conservative. The smaller the government the better... all the better to keep tabs on them. I’ll take Palin in a heart beat. The two Bush’s I’d flush down the toilet in a heart beat... and that’s better than what I’d do if I was given the privelage of 5 seconds alone with Hussein, Reid, NaziPelosi, Gibbs, Soros, Clinton, ...


84 posted on 12/24/2009 7:36:31 PM PST by 3boysdad (If you respond to my post without a profile I will claim you on my tax return.)
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To: rabscuttle385

It’s mostly considered a Republican hang out, is it not?


85 posted on 12/24/2009 7:40:05 PM PST by DakotaRed (What happened to the country I fought for?)
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To: rabscuttle385

Quoth a fella that wanted to sell a few books.


86 posted on 12/24/2009 7:41:15 PM PST by gusopol3
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To: Bokababe
Yes, WW2 was finished in half the time, without elected morons like Ron Paul and his mindless minions undermining and publicly opposing every step.

Pearl harbor was a sneak attack.

September 11, 2001 was a sneak attack.

What complete nonsense that you choose to ignore the parallels.

87 posted on 12/24/2009 7:42:18 PM PST by DakotaRed (What happened to the country I fought for?)
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To: DakotaRed
It’s mostly considered a Republican hang out, is it not?

Only if Republicans and conservatives are one and the same.

88 posted on 12/24/2009 7:46:20 PM PST by rabscuttle385 (Purge the RINOs! * http://restoretheconstitution.ning.com/)
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To: Bokababe

No, the real idiots are those who parrot the liberal anti-war talking points and try to pass themselves off as conservative.

If you don’t think taking the fight back to the Jihadists over there isn’t defense of this nation, your worse than an idiot.


89 posted on 12/24/2009 7:46:41 PM PST by DakotaRed (What happened to the country I fought for?)
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To: Bokababe
Even as complicated as WWII was, we finished it half the time that we've been in Afghanistan -- and we're aren't done yet.

The comparison is that the Japanese were also suicidal. Two A-bombs brought that to a halt. Germany was close to having A-bombs.

90 posted on 12/24/2009 7:48:47 PM PST by lakey (Congressperp: You were "hired" to be a servant of the People. YOU AREN'T ROYALTY.)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet
"Who are the Chinese going to sell their cheap plastic schlock to if they call our note?

If the economic power continues to flow out of this country at this rate, China won't continue to be the country making "the cheap plastic schlock" -- we will! I am not sure if you are old enough to recall -- but that stuff used to be "made in Japan" and look at Japan today. Fortunes shift and we aren't immune.

Who will the Russians and Saudis sell their oil and gas to?

The Russians and Saudis will continue to sell to Europe and already have more orders than they can handle from China.

And how will they “invade” the United States?

No one said that they'd need an Army

When our currency is virtually worthless and our housing market is dirt cheap, they just come over and buy everything that they can. Already, there are junkets coming over here from China to buy American real estate. This is the beginning. But unless we get this country back under control, it won't be the end of the Great American Fire Sale.

91 posted on 12/24/2009 7:48:49 PM PST by Bokababe (Save Christian Kosovo! http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: rabscuttle385

Post needs a barf alert.

Merry Christmas 385!


92 posted on 12/24/2009 7:49:02 PM PST by Nuc1 (NUC1 Sub pusher SSN 668 (Liberals Aren't Patriots))
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To: Bokababe

Good point.


93 posted on 12/24/2009 7:50:43 PM PST by 3boysdad (If you respond to my post without a profile I will claim you on my tax return.)
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To: DakotaRed

At an individual level Bush seems like a great guy. At a presidential level he was the worst RINO in recent history. Despite rising government receipts, he blew up spending beyond belief. Remember, the wars were “off balance sheet” so don’t factor into the deficits. The “Patriot Act” is now being used by Dems to label conservatives as terrorists. The medicare expansion will cause untold billions in deficits in the coming years. His failed attempt to give legal residency to illegals is now being used by Dems to turn Texas blue.

Last but not least, he failed to catch bin Laden despite everything else. God bless his retirement, but he was a terrible president.


94 posted on 12/24/2009 7:51:16 PM PST by ActrFshr
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To: 3boysdad

With our 2 party system, what choice did we have?

Bush, or Al Gore or John Kerry?

Bush was far from perfect and these ridiculosu open primaried gained us mcCain.

Ron Paul never stood a chance, not in 1988 nor in 2008. His message got out all too well.

Then again, the vitriolic nature of many of his cult followers turned a lot more pople off to him.

If you think destroying the GOP to the point that libertarians can easily take it over is the answer, prepare for decades of total Democrat rule.

As for Sarah, I’ll take her too and she is the reason I voted for McCain.

That and I feared Obama more.

McCain was the worst we could do, but he was still better than Obama is.

As far as conservative goes, anybody that I see repeating the junk posted over on Democratic Underground is no conservative in my book.


95 posted on 12/24/2009 7:51:51 PM PST by DakotaRed (What happened to the country I fought for?)
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To: rabscuttle385

Good luck with Ron Paulies taking over Free Republic too.

You and most over on Democratic Underground are in agreement.

Wouldn’t you feel better where your more accepted?


96 posted on 12/24/2009 7:54:07 PM PST by DakotaRed (What happened to the country I fought for?)
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To: BluesDuke

That was one of my cherished political books from years past. I have no doubt that Bovard is “consistent.” Anyone thinking he’s a liberal is an idiot.

But I do think in the attempt to be “balanced,” that he, like a lot of libertarians, is harsher in degree for the sins of the right than the left. Not that Bush was much of a rightist, IMO, since LBJ or the like could have said what he did in relation to Islamic Terrorism.


97 posted on 12/24/2009 7:55:24 PM PST by Skywalk (Transdimensional Jihad!)
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To: ActrFshr

And you think we are better off now?

Last I heard, Congress is who spends and Bush should have vetoed more.

Then again, he did get blind-sided with 911 and has history of reaching across the aisle, not that it did him any good.

All presidents make mistakes and yes, Bush made is share. But more than any other, he fought back when attacked, long over due.


98 posted on 12/24/2009 7:57:08 PM PST by DakotaRed (What happened to the country I fought for?)
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To: rabscuttle385

Paul / Grayson ‘12


99 posted on 12/24/2009 7:59:10 PM PST by gusopol3
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To: DakotaRed
"If you don’t think taking the fight back to the Jihadists over there isn’t defense of this nation, your worse than an idiot.

An idiot is someone who thinks that the jihadists and the war is only "over there" -- in spite of the fact that he is getting attacked on his own soil by his own adopted and native sons.

An idiot is someone who drops everything to chase a robber down the street while leaving his front & back door swinging open, assuming that there was only one robber.

There is much worse than an idiot.

100 posted on 12/24/2009 8:01:15 PM PST by Bokababe (Save Christian Kosovo! http://www.savekosovo.org)
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