Send Fewer Students to College (College is the wrong choice for many students)

National Review ^ | 10/27/2009 | Robert VerBruggen

[SeekAndFind]

This article was in response to an article written in NATIONAL REVIEW Entitled : Send More Students to College

We had an interesting exchange at FR here

[EyeGuy]

Higher education, in its gross inefficiency, soaring costs and wired-in lack of market forces rigor, is poorly designed for almost EVERYONE.

[dfwgator]

"Well, the world needs ditch diggers too."

[ClearCase_guy]

We ought to re-think our approach to education and careers. I really like vocational education or apprentice programs. Yes, there are some things which are best learned by sitting in classrooms, or spending hours at the library. But most people don't get (and would not want) that kind of job.

[STONEWALLS]

....time was a person with no college could get a good paying blue collar job...there’s just not as many of those any more.

[pnh102]

I don’t think that inner city charter schools themselves are what is causing better student performance. For the most part, the families with children who choose charter schools are already the types of people who value an education, and the charter school provides a good education without the distractions present in inner city public schools.

[Jmouse007]

Send fewer kids to college... RIGHT that’s the ticket... NOT! Translation = Obamessiah and his evil OVERLORDS need millions of new “slaves” to labor their lives away as SERFS within the new Amerikka they are building. While they themselves live and rule over us as kings and queens.

[Nosterrex]

I have two earned doctorates, so I have nothing against higher education; however, I see college kids go to college more as a right of passage than to obtain an education. The vast majority of these students major in subjects in which there is no demand in the “real world.” Not only that, but many of them assume huge indebtedness. It would be far, far better for most of these students to go to a vocational school and learn a trade of some sorts. If you can read and use the Internet, you can learn just about anything you want without ever having to enroll in a university. Higher education for the majority of students is a terrible waste of time and money.

[Lou L]

why, even before the economy crashed, were 25 percent of college graduates in their 20s working at jobs that didn’t require degrees?

What kinds of degrees did those 25% of college grads have? English Literature? Women's Studies? Urban Studies? Most other liberal arts majors?

Academia needs to stop glamorizing and legitimizing degrees like these, and they need to start focusing on degrees that will make us stronger and more competitive from an economic sense.

I'm not saying that all liberal arts classes are worthless; many of them should be kept, as they have their purpose. If a student has the desire and financial resources to take a lot of these liberal arts classes however, that's up to the student. Don't pursue a degree in Medieval French, and then expect to be overwhelmed with six-figure job offers when you enter the jopb market.

[bboop]

Yes, and they have essentially removed the Shop programs from the high schools, at least here in California. There is little VoTek training available to kids, and many are well-suited to hands-on work and run screaming from the theoretical academic nonsense that passes for education today.

[RipSawyer]

“Higher education, in its gross inefficiency, soaring costs and wired-in lack of market forces rigor, is poorly designed for almost EVERYONE.”
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True, and all of it will not compensate for squandering the K-12 opportunity along with the lack of real world experience for sub-teens and teenagers. I could probably write a book about the experiences young people used to have prior to finishing high school, experiences unavailable to most today. A youth spent of the farm along with a good public high school education, followed by a hitch in the military taught lessons that no college can offer.

[Jeff Chandler]

[upchuck]

I see college kids go to college more as a right of passage than to obtain an education.

BUMP!

That describes me. My "knowledge" gained from college has been of little use in my life. Full disclosure: my major was English. Because when I went to college in the 60s, majoring in English was the thing to do.

[RipSawyer]

“....time was a person with no college could get a good paying blue collar job...there’s just not as many of those any more.”
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There aren’t many good paying jobs for anyone any more. There are millions of college graduates who are grasping at straws andd ready to take any job, even at minimum wage. I can show you some who would be better off now had they spent their college years working in a convenience store or a fast food place.

Higher education is a wonderful thing but to fantasize about sending everyone to school until they are well into their twenties is absurd.

[cranked]

Colleges and Universities have become profit driven, hence, why they continually seek to enroll as many students as they can, even if it means lowering or fudging admission requirements.

Furthermore, with the increased enrollments comes increased drop-out rates (hence why colleges and universities have increasingly created and/or utilized retention departments or agencies) and those who extend their graduation times past the 4-year mark.

[HowlinglyMind-BendingAbsurdity]

Many colleges are the wrong choice for everyone.
The problem is the junk thought presented by many professors.
Just consider the current occupant of the White House certified by Columbia and Harvard Law.
Or is that certifiable?

The Fabian Socialist, Alinskyite, and Frankfurt School revolution currently
being waged from the White House upon Americans was certified
by the pseudo-elitism of the universities claiming Olympic status for American education.

That is a problem that will not be going away any time soon.

[Jeff Chandler]

I could probably write a book about the experiences young people used to have prior to finishing high school

Before I finished High School, I had a paper route, worked for a lawn maintenance company, worked in the mail room of a tax preparation company, and worked in a gas station. I was a Boy Scout patrol Leader, backpacked the Sierra Madres, played Little League Baseball, Pop Warner Football, high school water polo, and was on a swim team. I went target shooting with my own .22 rifle, shot skeet with a friend, rode dirt bikes in Mexico, SCUBA dived, speared fish, recorded 8mm underwater movies with an underwater camera I built myself, fished fresh water, salt water, and deep sea, trained in Kenpo Karate, learned classical piano, and played keyboard in a local rock band.

[Wonderama Mama]

I'm in California too in a very ‘prestigious’ school district and while there is no shortage of AP and Honor's classes, my middle of the road 10th grader doesn't have wood shop anymore. Sad really, but I told him, instead of going to college and paying for the tuition, which even at CSUN will run $20K, I would pay for him to start a business. He will need to write the business plan as if I were an investor. His school actually has an entrepreneurial after school club where kids can learn this aspect of business. It's hands on, but not for credit which is fine because he's not going to college! And we don't care! I already put two through expensive colleges and one is working two minimum wage jobs and interning for free.
We all need to rethink the college route for kids.

[EyeGuy]

Hear! Hear!

EVERYONE, including future Wall Street Investment Bankers, neurosurgeons, and Ivy League attorneys could benefit from a summer spent as a short order cook, carpenter’s apprentice, or with the experiences you mentioned.