Posted on 10/04/2009 2:59:27 PM PDT by OldDeckHand
Ten American troops were killed at the weekend in two surprise attacks that caused alarm in Nato’s US-led coalition.
In one, hundreds of insurgents attacked a pair of isolated outposts in eastern Afghanistan, killing eight US soldiers and several Afghan policemen in the deadliest battle in 15 months. Scores more Afghan policemen were reportedly captured by the Taleban.
In the other an Afghan policeman opened fire on the American soldiers with whom he was working in central Wardak province, killing two and injuring three.
It was unclear whether the policeman was working for the Taleban or simply ran amok but the attack fuelled the distrust that many Nato soldiers already feel for the Afghan security forces that they are supposed to be working with and training as part of the coalition’s eventual exit strategy.
(Excerpt) Read more at timesonline.co.uk ...
does it matter....our government has our guys hog tied so they cant even do a good job at staying alive...we need to commit to the fight or get out...instead of waisting our troops the way gov waist our money....
American lives are only important and splattered 24/24 when Republicans are in office....the media is complicit and obama is the tool!!!
“unless you are going to give them prompt and effective air support. “
Can you quantify “prompt and effective”?
Prayers for these and all our fallen heroes!
POTUS deigned to give Gen. McChrystal just twenty-five minutes of his oh-so-valuable time, on Air Force One, yet. What a jerk!
We know what an arrogant SOB he is. But is Obama so stupid as to risk losing the war in Afghanistan on his own watch? Is he!!?
If Obama doesn’t commit to those 40,000 additional troops, Gen. McChrystal should resign NOW.
“prompt and effective” re air support.
I guess that can be quantified in response time. IIRC, a call for artillery fire in Vietnam resulted in our getting steel on target within a minute or so.
If we needed close air support from the gunships, it always amazed us how the Cobra’s arrived in less time than the flight time from their base. We were further amazed how silent it got after they finished working over the AO with HE and nails (flechettes).
Not really; I guess if you survive it was prompt and effective.
One of the things that has amazed me about this war and even the war in Iraq is that fact that, even though we have large numbers of troops in the theater, they operate in small numbers, acting like a trip wire. They often get hit by groups far larger than themselves, and have to hold on until air power can get to them. In some cases its close by, in some cases it can take a long time. These guys impress me.
In Afghanistan, they have the guys spread out in small isolated outposts far from help, and regularly take on forces larger than themselves. Again, impressive.
What prompted the remark, and the remark I was replying to, is the fact that they've announced new rules of engagement meant to preserve the lives of civilians (which is a good thing). A week or so back several marines were jumped, called in artillery, which was denied under the new rules. They then called for air support which got to them after about an hour and a half if I remember right. By that time several marines were dead.
I don't know what constitutes "prompt and effective". I just know that the guys operate under conditions that are surprisingly unequal except for their superb training, superb equipment, and the fact that they can call in air support when things get really bad. I hope the new rules of engagement don't make that any more difficult than it already is.
Remember how Lou Dobbs used to give the daily body count of killed and wounded in the wars?
Notice he stopped now that Obama is President?
During my second tour in Nam, after the 2d Brigade of the First Cav redeployed to CONUS, our Team's closest Air Support was Bien Hoa...15 minutes away even for a fast mover. I am certain you know how much sh*t can happen in 15 minutes.
Obama doesn’t give a damn about how many American military are killed. He is content to let them wither while he dithers. After all, few of them will vote for him. That’s why he wants those illegal aliens made citizens. They will vote for him.
20 million illegal aliens are more important than 2 million soldiers.
RIP.
I think what might be just as important as the time-to-target calculation, is the specific ROE that either allows or limits the kinds of targets that can actually be engaged.
This last go around, it appears that one of the enemy assaults may have originated, at least in part, from a Mosque. We can't be afraid to engage the enemy, no matter where they hide and no matter how they shield themselves using the civilian populations.
As revolting as it sounds, Churchill and Roosevelt (and Truman) taught us that sometimes you have to spill an awful lot of blood to sometimes win what might appear to be inconsequential battles. The Taliban and the Afghans may never like or admire us, but they better start fearing us, or will never win this war.
Obama’s fault!
I was in Third Bde (Sep) 1st Cav later Task Force Garry Owen at Lassiter AAF 1971-72. Flew Hueys. Often as a single A/C we bedded down at the foot of Nui Chau Chinh loaded with flares and got scrambled to illuminate a firefight. Heard the calls for fire on fox mike and watched the `Snakes’ roll hot beneath us.
I should have been more specific. I was not a grunt but I carried lots of them and they were the bravest guys on this earth.
Mmm, mmm, mmm, Barack SOVAIN Obama,
Rotting in Denmark as Americans died in trauma.
bttt
Obama’s plan: Let things deteriorate to the point that a majority of Americans are clamoring for withdrawal, then blame Bush and announce a withdrawal.
“It’s what the people wanted” will be his plea.
I’m willing to bet the new ROE’s have stopped the hearts of some of these soldiers....gads and I never bet, I need to pray more, we all do.
Obama has yet to publish a National Security Strategy as required by Goldwater/Nichols. The US Military is rudderless all over, not just in Afghanistan.
Never met a chopper pilot who did not have a set of brass ba**s. :-)
Only question that remains is how we got so old so fast. :-(
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