“unless you are going to give them prompt and effective air support. “
Can you quantify “prompt and effective”?
“prompt and effective” re air support.
I guess that can be quantified in response time. IIRC, a call for artillery fire in Vietnam resulted in our getting steel on target within a minute or so.
If we needed close air support from the gunships, it always amazed us how the Cobra’s arrived in less time than the flight time from their base. We were further amazed how silent it got after they finished working over the AO with HE and nails (flechettes).
Not really; I guess if you survive it was prompt and effective.
One of the things that has amazed me about this war and even the war in Iraq is that fact that, even though we have large numbers of troops in the theater, they operate in small numbers, acting like a trip wire. They often get hit by groups far larger than themselves, and have to hold on until air power can get to them. In some cases its close by, in some cases it can take a long time. These guys impress me.
In Afghanistan, they have the guys spread out in small isolated outposts far from help, and regularly take on forces larger than themselves. Again, impressive.
What prompted the remark, and the remark I was replying to, is the fact that they've announced new rules of engagement meant to preserve the lives of civilians (which is a good thing). A week or so back several marines were jumped, called in artillery, which was denied under the new rules. They then called for air support which got to them after about an hour and a half if I remember right. By that time several marines were dead.
I don't know what constitutes "prompt and effective". I just know that the guys operate under conditions that are surprisingly unequal except for their superb training, superb equipment, and the fact that they can call in air support when things get really bad. I hope the new rules of engagement don't make that any more difficult than it already is.
I think what might be just as important as the time-to-target calculation, is the specific ROE that either allows or limits the kinds of targets that can actually be engaged.
This last go around, it appears that one of the enemy assaults may have originated, at least in part, from a Mosque. We can't be afraid to engage the enemy, no matter where they hide and no matter how they shield themselves using the civilian populations.
As revolting as it sounds, Churchill and Roosevelt (and Truman) taught us that sometimes you have to spill an awful lot of blood to sometimes win what might appear to be inconsequential battles. The Taliban and the Afghans may never like or admire us, but they better start fearing us, or will never win this war.