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You really need to read the whole article because he does a great job of debunking the idea that the world is overpopulated.

I found it real interesting the way he weaved the news about the Duggers expecting their 19th child and overpopulation being a farce real well.

1 posted on 09/02/2009 3:04:24 PM PDT by FredJake
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To: FredJake

BTTT


2 posted on 09/02/2009 3:06:52 PM PDT by Fiddlstix (Warning! This Is A Subliminal Tagline! Read it at your own risk!(Presented by TagLines R US))
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To: FredJake

Perhaps they were the inspiration for Idiocracy.


3 posted on 09/02/2009 3:07:30 PM PDT by Malsua
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To: FredJake

If all people in America would hold the truths of the Bible sacred they would never want to restrict their family size. It is so sad how many Christians of all denominations have bought into the materialism promoted by humanism and stop having kids at the birth of their second child. Time to reverse tis trend.


5 posted on 09/02/2009 3:09:54 PM PDT by Bushwacker777
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To: FredJake
More power to them!

They are not on the government dole.

They don't NEED a TV Reality Show like Jon - Kate + Eight to make ends meet. Mr. Dugger owns commercial Real Estate and has his own business. I find the show inspiring in contrast to Jon - Kate + Eight. All the Goselins are doing is making a mockery of “family” and entertaining folks with the disintegration of their family. This is a terrible way to exploit their kids.

6 posted on 09/02/2009 3:10:41 PM PDT by nmh (Intelligent people recognize Intelligent Design (God).)
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To: FredJake

Have you ever flown coast to coast across this country? (That is a rhetorical you) It is empty. Look down from that plane.

Lots and lots of space.


7 posted on 09/02/2009 3:10:48 PM PDT by Not gonna take it anymore
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To: FredJake

I don’t care if they have 50 kids.

They care and pay for their own children.

I wish my sons’ friends, all advanced degree’d in hard science, maths, biochem, and engineering would have lots of children instead of the none or one that they do.

My sons? Them, too.

Slow out of the gates.


9 posted on 09/02/2009 3:11:12 PM PDT by OpusatFR (Those embryos are little humans in progress. Using them for profit is slavery.)
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To: FredJake

I hope these people go for #20. Screw the whiners who cry when someone has a big family. That’s why Mexicans will own this country in 20 years.


11 posted on 09/02/2009 3:14:14 PM PDT by fr_freak
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To: FredJake
A friend and I were talking about this last night. I told him that since they pay for everything, have no debt including the 7,000 sq. ft. house, that it was none of my business how many kids they have. At least they are better than that Jon and Kate disaster. Both of my parents came from large families, not that large, and I loved growing up with all my cousins. The ones I really feel sorry for are the last ones of a family. That must be so sad. God bless the Duggars.
13 posted on 09/02/2009 3:14:45 PM PDT by MamaB (If you see someone without a smile, give them yours.)
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To: FredJake
http://www.laetusinpraesens.org/musings/multiply.php

 

 


Joy in the Present

"Be Fruitful and Multiply"

the most tragic translation error?

- / -


For the individual and the family, there are a number of well-recognized reasons to seek to build up a family. Personal security in later years and the need for labour on the family land are not the least of them for subsistence farmers the world over.

More questionable is the tendency of the major religions to encourage large families. The cynical would argue that this is an easy policy whereby the numbers of the faithful can be increased with little investment in missionary activity. But the faithful are reassured by holy scripture and notably, for the people of the Book, by the key phrase "be fruitful and multiply" (Genesis 1:28) .

In this case everything hangs on the understanding of "multiply". This understanding was of little importance when population levels were far from being critical. This is no longer the case. There is therefore merit in exploring possible misinterpretations of what was originally intended.

At present, with widespread education and teaching of arithmetic, there is little ambiguity to any understanding of "multiply". Is that so true of the period when the text was written?

For a start it is important to put current understanding of arithmetic in perspective. It was not until the 14th century (??) that the current numerals became commonly used. The zero in the pattern of numbers was a relatively late arrival. Without the zero, division becomes a very challenging arithmetical operation. In Roman times, there were no operations for multiplying or dividing as they are now known. The only procedure necessitated adding or subtraction.

Ironically it is Islam, as a historical torchbearer of mathematics, which through its architectural motifs, is most sensitive to complex tiling patterns over three-dimensional surfaces. There is a traditional antipathy of Christianity to mathematics, dating back to St Augustine: "The good Christian should beware of mathematicians, and all those who make empty prophecies. The danger already exists that the mathematicians have made a covenant with the devil to darken the spirit and to confine man in the bonds of Hell." [St. Augustine (354-430) , DeGenesi ad Litteram, Book II, xviii, 37]. But, ironically again, the much quoted Biblical injunction to "go forth and multiply" or "Be fruitful and multiply" (Genesis 1:28) -- on which policies with disastrous and far reaching implications for the planet are based -- is not subjected to dialogue between theologians and mathematicians.

What then could be the sense of "being fruitful" to "multiply" when the phrase was first used?

At the time this injunction was written, multiplication was not understood as a mathematical operation. Only addition and subtraction were possible. It might therefore be better translated as "increase", as featured in some Papal writings that also deal with the remainder of that same injunction, namely to "fill the earth and subdue it". From a mathematical perspective, "increase" may occur in many ways, some of which might be better associated in a theological perspective with "increase in comprehension", some "expansion" of the person, "growth in wisdom". It makes all the difference whether such increase is based on concentric circles radiating "out" from the person (to greater understanding of external reality), moving "within" the person (as progressively increasing understanding of internal reality), or rather as some form of serial replication. Similarly "subdue", and associated notions of "domination", would be well understood by mathematicians as achieving some form of cognitive control or comprehension of a complex phenomenon.

Consider the case of an amoeba. It is common to perceive an amoeba as "dividing" in order to reproduce. In this sense it "multiplies" by dividing. Can a woman also be said to divide when giving birth to a child? Some would argue that this is how they feel about the process, whether physically or emotionally. The same ambiguity prevails when a community grows beyond a certain critical size and then divides -- through a process whereby there is an effective multiplication.

This ambiguity is inherent to understanding of many growth processes. A growth in understanding is readily associated with the greater subdivision of a domain of knowledge. Progressive specialization is the continuing division of areas of expertise. This multiplies the number of things that are known.

If "multiply" in the original phrase is to be understood to mean "growth", it may be important to recognize the necessary division which accompanies that growth. In the case of the individual, it is clearly ridiculous to interpret such growth as an unrestricted increase in size, which might then result in some form of giantism if successful. Rather there is the expectationthat after reaching a certain physical size, growth will take other forms, expressed by such phrases as a growth in skills or a growth in maturity. Again a form of division somehow counteracts the simplistic understanding of additive growth.

In the case of a community, growth beyond a certain point evokes a need for some form of order. This order is usually closely associated with some form of functional division, and a division of responsibility. Even the largest of countries, or the United Nations system itself, evokes a need for organization into a comprehensible number of parts. Growth can be tolerated provided ways can be found to divide the whole into parts.

Is it wise to assume that "being fruitful to multiply" implied no need for appropriate"division"? Would it not be more appropriate to explore the implications for sustainable communities of the ambiguity in multiply-divide? No multiplication without division, no division without multiplication? The tao of mathematics?

Resistance to any such exploration comes in part from a sense in which "adding" (as the foundation of "multiplying") is seen as inherently more positive than "subtracting" (as the foundation of "dividing"). Taken further it is easy to understand how dividing can be seen as "evil". The process is obviously "divisive" and thus a favoured instrument of the devil. Religions can easily play on this.

The questionable status of subtraction in the collective psyche is also highlighted by an analysis of GNP, understood to be a measure of the health of a country. Unfortunately GNP increases when forests are cut down, with every oil spill, and with every cancer patient or accident. The greens argue that if the planet is to be saved then economists must learn to subtract as well as to add.

The challenge to understanding increases if the multiply-divide polarity is framed in terms of the integrate-differentiate polarity. The latter might almost be orthogonal to the former, with differentiation carrying some of the sense of both multiply and divide. Here it is clearer that without adequate differentiation, integration is of lesser import.

How should the phrase "being fruitful and differentiate" then be understood? How far is it useful to go in differentiation before some degree of integration is necessary to maintain any sense of significance? Is it purely a coincidence that there is so much concern with integration in modern societies? But note the ambiguity around "discrimination", readily condemned as an attitude but yet who would want to associate with someone completely lacking in discrimination?

What is the process of coherence that a simplistic approach to "multiply" ignores? Is the desperate search for a new social order a symptom of the failure to discover the secret of dividing? Whether at the individual, community, national or global level, sustainable identity may be associated with the ambiguity of the multiply-divide, integrate-differentiate polarities. The vain attempt to associate it with a polar understanding is a recipe for dissatisfaction and disaster.

Perhaps stretching this exploration too far, there is a need to recognize that the desperate search for unity at every level of society cannot be achieved through multiplication and differentiation alone. Simplistically, unity is achieved by dividing by the number to which multiplication has brought us.

 

 

http://www.laetusinpraesens.org/musings/multiply.php

 

 

15 posted on 09/02/2009 3:17:59 PM PDT by OldSpice
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To: FredJake
And I'm sure each kid gets personal attention from the parents.

Not.

16 posted on 09/02/2009 3:18:27 PM PDT by humblegunner
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To: FredJake

I would rather see the Duggers have 19 kids, than see a welfare recipient have any. I have high confidence that the Duggers’ kids will grow up to be contributing members of society, while welfare kids are more likely to be tax consumers.


20 posted on 09/02/2009 3:21:14 PM PDT by PapaBear3625 (Public healthcare looks like it will work as well as public housing did.)
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To: FredJake

They have the right to have as many children as they can love and support. I do worry about the mother’s health, though. But again, she makes her own decisions.


21 posted on 09/02/2009 3:21:23 PM PDT by ShandaLear (Cronyism, Protectionism, Socialism, Obamunism)
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To: FredJake

When I first learned about world population, it stood at two and half billion. Now it is over six and a half billion. Maybe that colors my view of the situation. At the same time I was learning what the phrase “exponential growth” meant.


22 posted on 09/02/2009 3:22:26 PM PDT by firebrand
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To: FredJake
My wife and I raised six children, the last is in his senior year of high school.

I can not tell how many times while we were out as a family we were asked if we were Catholic, Mormon, etc, etc.

Many times people would ask why we had so many kids if we could not afford them, just assuming we were on some type of government dole. I never took a dime from any form of government.

After a while I developed a form of mockery to put these idiots in their place. When they would assume my wife and I were welfare king and queen by having six kids, I would tell them, "You are right, we have too many kids, so you get to pick the ones I will get rid of, please pick two or three to your liking. We are going to do a post abortion tonight and you are welcome to watch"

After the shock and I had their attention, I would explain it is none of your business how many kids I have as long as I don't take a dime out of your pocket, which I never have, then hand them a quarter and tell them to call someone who care what they think.

I only had one person call the police!

28 posted on 09/02/2009 3:29:42 PM PDT by Popman (Obama "may" be a US citizen, but he's not an American)
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To: FredJake

Congratulations to the Duggers. I am happy for them.


39 posted on 09/02/2009 3:41:30 PM PDT by PA Engineer (Liberate America from the occupation media.)
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To: FredJake

Before they became a reality show, TLC, I believe, did two specials on them, a year or so apart. In the second special, Ty Pennington along with Extreme Makeover, including Sears, Home Depot, Huggies, and an assortment of retailers, finished the house, which was barely a frame at the time. Sears gave them their appliances, and Extreme Makeover decorated and furnished it. I remember watching the show, and was pleased.

They no longer need to live frugally, because they are millionares from the show. However, if they have another dozen kids, they can afford it, and the kids seem to be great kids. But, with her age, and that many children, her health and the health of the baby might be jeopardized.


48 posted on 09/02/2009 3:50:23 PM PDT by Jaidyn
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To: FredJake
Right about now many liberals are screaming that the world is already overpopulated and this couple are just adding to the problem.

You won't catch them complaining about Muslims having too many children.

52 posted on 09/02/2009 3:53:05 PM PDT by Moonman62 (The issue of whether cheap labor makes America great should have been settled by the Civil War.)
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To: MrsLilac

Duggars ping


61 posted on 09/02/2009 4:27:50 PM PDT by AZ .44 MAG (A society that doesn't protect Jim Thompson's children doesn't deserve to survive.)
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To: FredJake

As long as the taxpayer doesn’t have to pay for them, they can have a hundred. This is not China.


62 posted on 09/02/2009 4:29:24 PM PDT by dog breath
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To: FredJake

I always wonder why people I’ve talked to seem to hate these people. Even “Christians”. Who cares that they’re expecting #19? Obviously they’re doing a phenomenal job raising their children to be real Christians. They’re well-behaved, respectful and all good looking (if that matters). God has blessed this family with many things, one being a clue another being debt free..... We could all learn something from them.


64 posted on 09/02/2009 6:18:13 PM PDT by MrsLilac (Don't let your mind wander. It's too small to be let out on it's own.)
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