Replies

This is a tough one.

I believe there are people who are very good Conservatives, that could see Palin differenctly than you and I do.

I believe that, because I have had to ask myself whether my support for her was based on who/what she was in total, or my wish for her to be what I wanted her to be. At all times up until now, I have avoided having to make this determination based on the idea that my opinion did not matter at the particular point in time. When she ran with McCain, I wasn't needed to voice my opinion of her, good or bad. I wasn't going to vote for McCain. I didn't need to trash or laud Palin. I believe all my comments were very positive about her. There are a number of things I truly like about her. This spring it was my thought that I would let things play out, let her prove herself before I had to make any further judgements. I have continued to defend her. I have contacted various entities in her defense when I thought it was appropriate. I have tried to ask folks to be a little more patient with her on the forum, as I didn't think she was as lacking in experince has some folks did. Friday brought this to a head. I thought it was time to be frank about how I saw her actions. I gave it some thought. I tried to guage what I've seen over the years in politics, and how I thought this would play out for her. I have addressed that. I have addressed how I think it will impact her political future. I have not addressed my views of her in total.

I can't tell you what the writer was thinking. I can tell you what my read of what he has written means to me.

It’s just impossible to stomach the stupidity on this site anymore.

"I have read the posts in defense of Palin on this forum, and it's hard to take how far off base they are."

I don't see it this way. I think people are having a natural reaction to what has taken place. I think they are circling the wagons considerably more than I would like to see at this moment, but I say that for the same reason they think I should tone it down. They want things to play out more before I come to my own concusions, and that is also a natural reaction. That's what the forum is for. We debate the issues.

After all these years of posting here, I think it’s time to find another place.

"These posts have been so disconcerting, that it has caused me to consider if I wish to be here any longer. What sounds like sweet music to you with regard to Palin, sounds like fingernails on a chalkboard to me. That bothers me so much, I am having a hard time identifying with folks here at the moment."

I don't see this so much as anti-Conservatism, as I see it as anti-(what this person thinks is)boneheadism. (So I don't find as much offense to it, as others have. If he was trashing Palin for backing Conservative policy and saying he couldn't stand that, my ears would perk up considerably.) He thinks Plains move was severaly flawed. He thinks the defense of it is severely flawed. Look, I disagree with the degree to which he has become exercised over this, but I have also found her move to be ill advised, and the defense of it to be awfully forgiving. I'm not inclined to give folks a hard time for defending her, but I do plan to provide another view here. I'm not doing it to trash Palin. I still plan on supporting her during campaigns. I just cannot defend this move, or act like it's not going to hurt her. I wish it weren't going to, better yet hadn't come to this in the first place.

What kind of dopes cannot see that this pinhead woman, who when speaking off the cuff makes George Bush sound brilliant, just abandoned a post she was SWORN to fill, and that she did so for the flimsiest of reasons.

"This woman convinces me she is a lightweight, and I think folks would have to be dopes not to see it as well. When she speaks, she makes George Bush sound a lot smarter. She just announced she will be stepping down from a her elected postion, for the flimsiest of reasons.

There are times when I don't see Sarah as polished as I would like. She has about three years to go on that front. I think she'll do better as she spends more time in front of the public. That is my hope anyway. The reasons she used for stepping down, are good ones to some folks. At the end of the day I don't think they fill the bill. Stepping down was a huge mistake IMO, and I have said so.

No matter what I think of the merits of the reasons, if at the end of the day if I don't believe they justify the move, then I can't state that they aren't too flimsy for me. They are. They're excellent excuses, but that's not the same thing.

AT BEST, she dumped Alaska on her Lt. Gov. because she wants to make money on a book and feel out her chances for national office. That’s the height of irresponsibility and self-centeredness — SHE HAD AN OATH TO UPHOLD.

"The best I can see, she dumped Alaska on ther Lt. Governor because she wanted to make money on a book deal, and feel out here chances to be Presient. That's the height of irresponsiblity and self-centeredness. She swore to fulfill the job to the best of her abilities."

I'm not of the same mind on the book deal. I may be proven wrong in weeks. I can't say. I wouldn't be shocked if she did. I do believe she is going to try to help potential Congress-critters get elected, build up chits nationally, and make a bid for the Presdiency. I have made it clear, I don't think this is the time to do it. Others have disagreed. With regrard to the book deal, I have said that I think a much better book deal is one that covers a full term in office, explains in detail the things she had to endure, and reveals what a tough cookie she was without her having to say it in so many words. The book she may publish now, just wouldn't appeal to me.

I wouldn't address this as her displaying the height of self-centeredness. I do believe that in her mind she has family considerations, the state, and federal issues on her mind. Can I fault anyone for taking that point of view? Well, I'm not comfortable with it. I still can't say it's completely off base. I think someone could just as easily state that she is doing what she thinks is best for the nation. Heaven only knows this nation is in a world of hurt right now. I think she could be forgiven for thinking it was her mandate to help get it back on course. A good rebuttal to that would be dilusions of granduer, but I don't buy that. There is cause to consider this to be a somewhat reasoned point of view for her to take. And if she believes it, she would be shirking her duty not to do it. Now, that being said, I must clarify.

She could still help after she left office at the end of 2010. Up until then, she could still make custom DVDs or internet videos in support of Congressional Candidates to help bring about a change in the majority there. I think it's a real possibility whether she shows up on site or not. And I don't think it would be seen by her state to be totally inappropriate if she made a few swings to battle-ground states to support Republicans. Hell, that's been done since our nation began, by sitting politicians.

Conservatives who shrug and say so what to that kind of irresponsibility are not conservatives I recognize. Can anyone imagine Ronald Reagan breaking a solemn oath?

"Conservatives on this forum who shrug and say so what to these kinds of actions on Palin's part, are not Conservatives I recognize. Can you see Ronald Reagan doing this kind of thing, breaking and oath?"

I believe that most oaths state something to the effect that the person taking the oath will to the best of their ability fulfill the functions of the office. I believe that Palin was doing a good job as Govenor. It stands to reason she could have continued to do so. I will say, that if she did believe herself incapable of performing those duties, it would be a sad but reasoned duty for her to step down. I don't believe that to be the case here. I also believe that is something that each person will have to decide for themselves. As I have said before, I would have left fingernails on the doorsills before I allowed the Democrats to drag me kicking and screaming out of the state capital of Alaska, if this were me. I say so, because it will be a cold day in hell, before I would allow the Democrats to force me from office, without justifiable cause. I was saddened when Tom Delay stepped down. I determined right there, that was not the thing to do. It sent too many messages for my taste. The Republican leadership should have stood behind him all the way.

Sarih Palin has never had a shot at the WH.

"Sarah didn't have a shot before this, and now this."

I don't believe that. I think Beckett got worked up, and overstated his case here. Palin is very popular on the right. She's outdrawing every other Republican at events. She has been popular with some Democrats and Independents too up until now.

She had a shot. She still may. I still come back to the stepping down part, and what happenes when the going got tough. I can't just wave my hand and make it disappear.

She’s much too unqualified and serious people can see it whenever she opens her mouth without a script.

"She's not Presidential material. If you're honest you make note of it when she talks. She's lousy without a script."

I'm not convinced she's ready to walk into the Oval Office today. At the present time it's impossible to state that she will not mature and improve before 2011. I don't think she's as lousy without a script as Beckett does, but I do believe his is an opinion that a Conservative could come to, if they forgot some important factors. I very stongly disagree, partly because it is overstated, but also because it intimates she is frozen in time, and will never get better. She's going to get better. I believe she is a lot more intelligent than some folks give her credit for. And despite her recent action, I also think she's much tougher than this makes it look. Darn, darn, darn....

But now it seems she’s about to lead the “true believers” at FR and other outposts of the right further into the wilderness, too, and completely marginalize conservative thought at a time when Obama is socializing the nation.

"There is a very real possibility that if folks don't remain reasoned and completely give themselves over to Palin, there could come a time when it would cause the Conservative movement damage. If that were the case, it couldn't come at a worse time."

I believe we dismiss this possibility, at our own loss. I would urge folks to remain engaged. Support Palin as you please. Over the coming years, please promise yourself you will remain loyal to Conservatism, and if some things come out about Sarah and some other candidate does wind up looking better, or even better positioned to win, so long as they aren't moderates, that we will keep our options open. She may wind up looking a bit worse than someone else on a few issues, but her popularity may remain too high to ignore. If so, then she's the go to person.

We just need to keep our wits about us. Me too, so don't write me off like I'm not going to support Palin. I have made my assessment of what her actions will garner her. That doesn't mean that I have abandoned ship. I am looking around.

Look folks, a lot of people thought John McCain was the cat's meow last year. They followed him blindly into oblivion. While Palin will never be a John McCain in most senses, she could beome one if we were to affix ourselves to her in blinded loyalty.

Great work Sarah.

"You really screwed up Sarah."

Well, maybe so. Perhaps she'll win by a few less percentage points. Perhaps she'll win with more percentage points. Perhaps she won't win. Perhaps she won't even get the nomination. It remains to be seen.

As a few people have posted to me on threads, there may be things afoot that none of us are aware of. I suppose so. Anything's possible... almost.

All in due time I suppose.

Look, Beckett's comments don't win my support. I still don't think it's quite the calamity that others do. He's not advocating liberal policy, and his opinion will be forgotten about 3.3 years before it really matters, as will mine.

I give you a lot of credit for putting so much thought and effort into your response concerning post #77. It's easy to see your sincerity, and that you want to engage in a good discussion, rather than tear down posters or candidates. You know the difference between enthusiastic argument and ad hominum attacks/flaming. You impress me as a peacemaker.

That having been said, ever since Sarah Palin made her announcement, there's been a flurry of activity at FR by individuals, many of them Romney supporters, who call Sarah names while saying she's finished. They have talking points that make it clear they are interested in Sarah's destruction, rather than expressing an opinion, or presenting a valid argument. They are engaging in the politics of personal destruction by making derogative statements about Sarah, as well as being insulting to her supporters, and conservatives in general.

Free Republic is a conservative website, and posters who are clearly RINOs really don't have any business being here. If someone refers to Sarah as being a “pinhead woman,” they deserve to be called on it, especially since this behavior is being displayed on a number of threads simultaneously.

So, there it is.

I've been following this all day. May I suggest you read a very little book with a long title:
HOW TO GET ALONG WITH NASTY PEOPLE WITHOUT BEING NASTY YOURSELF or Simply THE NASTY BOOK...Cheap used at amazon.

It explains in detail the “art” of invalidation.... Everyone does it at one time or another, most of the time we are not aware we are involved in it. It's unintentional.

OTOH it is a technique used to control and minimize people. (often used by bigots, abusers and misogynists)

Read it and then re-read this thread....Your opinion may change a bit.

Look, Beckett's comments don't win my support. I still don't think it's quite the calamity that others do. He's not advocating liberal policy, and his opinion will be forgotten about 3.3 years before it really matters, as will mine.

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Thanks for a very thoughtful post. I agree with the above. I also must say that I am not familiar with beckett, whether he was ever a Palin supporter, or which candidate he supporter in 2008, which may or may not have some bearing on his comments during this thread.

If I found that he was a Romney supporter would it affect my interpretation of post #77? Indeed it would.

Am I disappointed that Palin resigned? You bet I am. I do think that there has been a strong reaction to this unexpected news, and that we all should wait until we know more about Palin's plans for the future. Yet, I can understand how some can be quite discouraged at this point. We don't have a limitless number of good, conservative candidates from which to choose.

All along there has been criticism of Palin, I believe particularly from Romney supporters. I believe that that camp is now annoyed that we are not moving fast enough to dump Palin and move on.