Posted on 05/28/2009 6:59:42 PM PDT by tobyhill
probably, if we still have runways and air superiorty we can land planes full of troops, airliners if need be.
There is a problem here -
North Korea is not just a nasty dictator and his friends, it is also @20 million mostly innocent people. Call it @ 500,000 genuine enemies and 21 million hostages (1 million being the South Koreans and Japanese the NK’s could realistically threaten to kill).
If it came to such a war, and there was no MAD-style nuclear risk a la the old Soviets, ALL means must be tried before nuclear attacks, even if it risks high casualties to US and South Korean forces.
I certainly understand that - but the realization is the little whacko would not hesitate to turn Seoul into a Hiroshima - but hey, Obama will solve it all and diplomatically wipe him off the face of the earth...he’s all powerful you know - :)
The ROK army is about 500-600 k and posssses modern though not state of the art weaponry. The US has 2ID in country and either a Marine div or brigade size force in Okinawa. If the norks come and don't use the nukes they will suffer enormous losses but they will take Seoul and inflict severe damage to our side, not to mention the losses to several millions of ROK civvies in and around the capital.
2nd infantry could lose more people in a week than we did in Iraq in 5 years. I don't think America is ready for that kind of carnage and I KNOW Obama and his minions aren't.
Not only would we have Chinese troops in there, we would also have Russian troops and support forces. Both of them have anti-Stealth technology and Russia may already have 5th generation fighter aircraft.
The North Koreans have plenty of artillery tubes, true, to be shot from fixed positions without observation. They can’t be moved without being destroyed en masse by allied artillery and aircraft. These would (or could, I think the condition of this stuff at this point is questionable) create a terrific unaimed bombardment along the DMZ which allied units, being mobile, can avoid.
How could the Norks reach Seoul ? They can’t come out of their holes without getting massacred. The South Koreans possess plenty of armor far superior to what the Norks have, and plenty of artillery that is mobile, has excellent observation and targeting, and can be used effectively to destroy any unit in motion. And then there is US and Korean airpower. And these can also be used with precision in the dark and bad weather. Its not 1950 anymore. Any North Korean attack would be exterminated before it begins.
The ROK army is several million strong when mobilized, 500-600K is just the peacetime figure, mostly the regular cadre plus those doing their military service. That is plenty to hold a impenetrable line across the penninsula given absolute air supremacy and modern technology.
2ID is now based in the US. There is I think still a brigade on 2ID in Korea plus service units, and pre-positioned equipment for the whole division and maybe one other, I don’t recall.
Er, there are no Russian troops coming. What for ?
And they don’t really have anything they didn’t have in 1991. All hat, no cattle that bunch.
And I doubt any Chinese either, unless they go mad.
“It would be an interesting fight, to be sure.”
Yeah
I work with some retired Army folks who lived many years in Korea.
They said that of NK was going to invade SK that they’d have to do it in Winter before the rivers and paddys thaw...
Otherwise they’d never get thru the back ups on the roads around Seoul let alone out fight the kimchis.
Interesting point.
Of course we can. We have 300 million people and the largest economy (and manufacturing base) in the world. All that would be required is diverting the $11 trillion to defense instead of pork projects. H3!!, for $11 trillion, we should be able to pretty much do as we please.
You don’t realize how bloody a shooting war could be in Korea.....thousands dead. North Korea would throw everything at us including nukes. Kim and his generals know once shooting starts its the regimes death sentence.
And NK would hold it's nukes in reserve so as to use them in case it needs another bargaining chip.
his generals know once shooting starts its the regimes death sentence.
Not buying that either.
The last shooting war did not end with the end of that government. - far from it, and we threw near everything that we had except nukes.
The Chicoms were the wild card, and they would be again.
No Chinese government would allow massive intervention by us to occur without a large and nasty response.
You sure post a lot of hit-and-run posts that are mostly cr@p. For once, post some EVIDENCE of what you are saying. You can start with this bunch of bull:'....and Russia may already have 5th generation fighter aircraft.' What 5th Gen fighter aircraft does Russia have? Do you mean the PakFa, which is still a concept. For once add meat to your bull, rather than your usual Russian/Chinese 'super weapon' crap.
There, now I feel better!
That's because the North Korean border is just a hop, skip and a few day's tank drive from Beijing. If they lose the North Korean buffer, there's nothing between their capital and us. It's really the same calculus that got Mao involved in the 1950's.
North Korea has some great opening moves, and no logistical staying power. The DMZ will be an unholy meatgrinder, Seoul will be laid in ruins, and the north will run out of steam. Everyone knows this. It's just a matter of weeks. Which means that while the DMZ is on fire, China can either wait for us to prevail and make our way to their border, or they can push down to Pyongyang and 'help us out' by seizing North Korea themselves.
All internet bravado aside, China doesn't want to fight us, and we don't want to fight them. Still, if we had to endure unparalleled carnage on the north/south border, while the Chinese 'humanitarian / stabilization force' rolled in the back, took the country unopposed and then declared peace, if would be a hard thing for us to stomach.
It ain't 1950. If China gets involved this time, they'll be 'on our side', and the DPRK will fall. The ROK and the US will pay a terrible price for an easy Chinese victory.
Troops always go by air these days. It’s the equipment, supplies, food, etc. that is the hard and slow part!
It was more like a year in 1991.
August 2 1990 - Jan 15 1991
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