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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

[[Those who support Intelligent Design should be reserved with either embracing on condemning physics at this level, because arguments can be made for many competing theories that are essentially neutral to the concept of Intelligent Design. Importantly, they are also neutral to the idea of their not being Intelligent Design as well.]]

There is no reason to be reserved— the goal is not to ‘prove God’, but to present enough evidence to show a very strong probability, a ‘beyond reasonable doubt’ probability, that qan i9ntelligence is needed for hte act, causation, design, or complexity. ID is not in the business of ‘proving God’- that is not their requirement nor goal- their only two objectives, purely speaking, are to both provide enough evidence to show a beyond reasonable doubt case for hte need for an Intelligence, AND to provide enough evidence to hsow that nature simply is incapable of the organized irreducible complexity seen in nature

The argument can and should, expand into physics as well, as the many neutral cases you mention, as well as the cases that are biased toward the need for ID, and agaisnt the idea nature caused it, also add a great deal of weight to the contention that an intelligent designer was needed


135 posted on 05/25/2009 1:51:57 PM PDT by CottShop (Scientific belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge)
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To: CottShop

Referencing Kaballah again, one could make the argument that while Intelligent Design was used by JHVH, in a manner of speaking, it is no longer involved, as such. To explain:

In Kaballah, JHVH created the universe to answer a question, “Is there anything that isn’t me?”, or the equivalent. To do this, JHVH created a situation of “contraction”, a place where there wasn’t JHVH. Into this void, through the use of a very complicated “bolt of lightning”, JHVH materialized a single particle, which was to endlessly replicate and form increasingly complex arrangements, eventually at the end of the universe to form a “mirror”, reflecting JHVH.

Then JHVH could see if there was anything that was not JHVH, and the universe would cease to exist and the void would again be filled with JHVH.

By this description, though JHVH created the initial particle, since then it has been up to the endless iterations of the particle to do the rest and create the mirror.

So JHVH using Intelligent Design, but then the universe doing so on its own ever since.

While this is a very crude summary of that part of Kaballah, it does present a case for both Intelligent and natural design.


155 posted on 05/25/2009 6:30:17 PM PDT by yefragetuwrabrumuy
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