Posted on 04/07/2009 5:33:53 AM PDT by marktwain
Does New York massacre give new firepower to bills filed in Austin?
By Anita Miller News Editor
San Marcos — When police in Binghamton, N.Y. went looking for the gunman who killed 13 people before committing suicide on Friday, the Associated Press reported they led out “a number of men in plastic handcuffs” while they sorted out who was who.
Had there been someone in that immigrant community center licensed to carry a concealed handgun who had drawn their weapon and ethnically resembled the shooter, police might have shot him by mistake.
Tragic as it is, the New York case may serve to support the point some in local law enforcement have made regarding Sen. Jeff Wentworth’s (R-San Antonio) legislation that would allow those with concealed handgun licenses to carry their weapons on the campuses of Texas colleges and universities.
Texas State Police Captain Paul Chapa acknowledges that such a shooting could happen here, but if it does and police were to encounter a student with a drawn but legal weapon, “We’re not going to ask where the concealed handgun permit is, we’re going to shoot.”
Chapa, like the rest of the university police force, has undergone “active shooter” training at the San Marcos-based Advanced Law Enforcement Rapid Response Training (ALERRT).
“You go in and isolate the threat. If you go in and find someone with a gun and the call is for a man with a gun, that’s your approach,” he said.
“We don’t think more guns on campus necessarily makes a safer campus,” said Diana Hendricks, ALERRT’s director of communications and governmental relations.
Hendricks said ALERRT has “worked closely with university police departments around the country” and believes that proper training of campus police comes closer to ensuring the safety of students.
Wentworth’s bill has yet to reach the full Senate. Its language is very near that of similar legislation he filed in 2007.
Chapa said a position paper created back then by the Texas Association of College and University Police Administrators opposing allowing concealed weapons on campus is still valid today.
It states, “with regard to crimes against persons which could potentially justify the use of deadly force, such as the use of a firearm, individuals are generally safer on the campuses of institutions of higher learning in this State than they are in the communities in which the campuses are located. The majority of reported on campus crimes” at state colleges and universities, the paper continues, “have no violent component, rendering the issue of concealed carry of firearms on campus virtually meaningless in the prevention of campus crime.”
Chapa said the primary crime on the Texas State campus is theft, which raises the possibility that concealed weapons could be stolen. “If a student is going to store their gun in their book bag, we’re going to have an increase in theft of weapons.”
Wentworth’s bill, and companion legislation in the House of Representatives, “looks like it’s getting a lot of support,” Chapa said. “All we can do is kind of prepare for it. Our focus is not to deny the right of anyone to carry a weapon, he said, adding the mission of university police is “to provide for the safety and security of the communities we have sworn to protect.”
Wentworth’s’ bill is SB 1164.
I think the RISK of being shot by ignorant cops is preferavble to the CERTAINTY of dying at the hands of a cunning killer.
Go ahead, you cheap political hack (aren't all the police leadership in every city and state hacks any more?), shoot first and ask questions later. And then pray that I'm not on the jury for the cops who didn't even bother to announce and demand the shooter stand down.
Not to bash the police here, but to make one more point about the Chief's comment above - generally, based on what we've seen in the last couple of mass shootings, the cops get there, stand around, wait until the shooting is over, and then chalk line the bodies. They don't have to draw their guns and show bragadocio about shooting first and asking questions later - they never even confront the shooters.
I'm not impressed with this nitwit's cheap display of "courage". Courage is the officers who make an middle of the night stop on a carload of people who are weaving and have a tail light out. That's police courage, to me.
First, the politicians disarm us through artfully crafted rules and regulations that they claim are necessary to keep guns out of the hands of criminals;
Second, after establishing gun free zones, they craft additional rules and regulations that limit the police from taking immediate action against crazed murderers who always manage to get guns and use them to pen up and murder larger numbers of legislatively disarmed victims.
Third, the politicians then use the emotion generated by these massacres to craft additional legislation to further disarm us.
This cycle has to be stopped somewhere.
Very well stated....I couldn;t agree more.
You weren't. You were bashing police chiefs, something which should be done loud, long and often.
There is a question I have never seen answered in the media.
Virginia Tech, did any of the 32 victims attempt to stop the killer before they died or did they just lay down like sheep to slaughtered?
True they were unarmed, but....
Also, what happened in Binghamton was not a traditional campus, per se. It was at a smaller center with a classroom, hence no campus police would be dispatched to respond. That’s why they had to depend on the response of the local police, and unfortunately many more were killed in the interim. I wholeheartedly believe that if a CCW holder, an armed security guard, or a detailed LEO were there, there’d be less than 13 dead. As far as a CCW holder is concerned, they could have just holstered their pistol after the melee, then waited, and answered questions later. It just further proves that when perps know the area is unarmed, it compels them to attack the unarmed occupants. To disagree, truly displays one’s ignorance towards this subject.
Chapa is an idiot. Our Office’s team would respond immediately, and if there was an active shooter, their goal is to take him/her alive, rather than shoot first and ask questions later.
Be that as it may, if there were a person with a firearm, I am sure there would not have been so many victims. I am grateful my Sheriff knows and understands that.
"Had there been someone in that immigrant community center licensed to carry a concealed handgun who had drawn their weapon and ethnically resembled the shooter, police might have shot him by mistake."
How long did it take them to identify the victims?
IOW, when the police was outside sipping coffee, they had no clue as to who was inside let alone who could have had a concealed gun license.
People were huddled in the boiler room. If a shooter was in there with them, wouldn't they all be dead also?
Hmm -"ethnically resembled the shooter" - interesting. So anyone not white looking or appearing well to do would be a police target?
guess what! Obama welcomes 'peace loving' muslims here, so the police better start rethinking their stereotyping. Make knives illegal. I heard that many loose their heads with them (Buffalo ? NY).
Any citizen who wants to carry a gun, should have that right.
meant to say “not appearing well to do”
with that cops logic, the police should be shot if their is a weapon drawn.. just becuase you are wearing the police uniform, dont mean your a good guy. there are bad cops, and there are bad guys that could dress like cops.
so let that ploice chief know, if any one dressed like a cop approaches me with a gun drawn, I should shoot him on sight, no question asked.
so now the safety of the officier trumps protecting the public, the public that has a Right to be armed, and a Right to self defence.
what a chicken s$&t cop. how about you cops risking your life for the public. I thought that is why we pay them so much and give them super pensions, cuase they are supposed to rick their life for the public. just like the military. what a chicken no good for nothing police chief. to oder to shot to kill anyone with a gun is premeditated murder. the police chief I hope has opened his chicken department up for a big lawsiut.
cops are now the thought police (hate crime laws) defenders of murder (they arrest pro-lifers) they break the 2 nd admendment (enforcing un-Constitutional laws). now they say you will be shot if you pull a gun to defend yourself.
what good are cops anyway??? Oh yeah, to investigate, thats all. pay them minimum wage, cause thats all they are worth. let real lawenforcement start with each citizen.
yep no bias here
LLS
This man should be removed from duty.
This guy is a real piece of work. A true shoot first and ask questions latter kinda guy. Sickening if you aren't required to assess a situation before pulling the trigger.
Other thoughts: Removed by moderator
I will clarify that this is not a Dept. of Public Safety officer (who are the "state police"). This is a captain in the police force at Texas State University.
I'm in the process of composing a letter to the organization now, advising them of the legal peril they just created for themselves, and suggest that Capt. Chapa be relieved from duty pending an investigation.
If the people there were allowed to be armed, the police would not shoot the one with the gun, because the attack wouldn't have happened in the first place.
One thing common about all these massacres is that they occur only where the attackers know their victims cannot shoot back. They do not occur where people are allowed the means to defend themselves. The state of Utah, for instance, allows people with a concealed weapons permit to bring a gun onto school grounds, and Utah has never had a school shooting of any kind.
From reports I've read, the CCW holder would have had 45 minutes to drop the perp, reholster his weapon and report an 'all clear' to the SWAT team cowering outside.
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