Kiss Me, I’m Irish

Special to FreeRepublic ^ | 14 March 2009 | John Armor (Congressman Billybob)

[seoul62]

Thank you./Just Asking - seoul62........

[PotatoHeadMick]

“What do you mean by this?”

What I mean is that in the modern media and in popular history and culture how your ethnic group is regarded is determined whether your ancestors arrived in America before or after the second great wave of immigration in the middle and late nineteenth century.

Hence if your people were among the original white settlers, British, German or Dutch, then I’m afraid they’re going to get a bit of a bad press. They will be depicted as “victimisers”, almost invariably guilty of America’s ‘original sin’; racism, genocidal Indian killers, slave owners that sort of thing. The worst villains of all are the people whose descendants today are the only ethnic group about whom it is acceptable to be racist; the Scots Irish who settled in western Pennsylvania, the Appalachians and the South. Such “hillbillies” and rednecks are rarely given a sympathetic portrayal today despite them being the cornerstone of American history and culture.

On the other hand if your people came over in the emigrant ships of the late nineteenth century, the Poles, Italians, Greeks etc then you will be given a much more sympathetic story. Your people will invariably be depicted as slightly exotic, poor but thoroughly decent folks who struggled against discrimination and victimisation to build a new home in America. Most favoured race of these people is of course the Catholic Irish who are never shown in anything other than a positive light.

Hence the fact that while most Americans who have Irish ancestry will in fact be descended from the dour hard fighting Scots Irish of Ulster they will prefer to depict themselves as the fiddly-die ‘top o’ the mornin’ type of Irishmen as evidenced by the shamrocks and leprechaun blarney that will be very much in evidence today.

[PotatoHeadMick]

Thanks I will have a look at Albion’s Seed, sounds interesting. Have a happy St Patrick’s Day.

[garandgal]

I read your posts with interest. I too, have an ancestor who came to the U.S. in about 1812...as a mercenary (so they say). Like the other poster's ancestor, he ended up in Ohio. He was a real character; a fighter, an appraiser, a letter to the editor writer (I've read some of them); he also had his last child with his second wife when he was 80.

Cade was the name...not sure where in Ireland he came from.

[jla]

Hence the fact that while most Americans who have Irish ancestry will in fact be descended from the dour hard fighting Scots Irish of Ulster they will prefer to depict themselves as the fiddly-die ‘top o’ the mornin’ type of Irishmen as evidenced by the shamrocks and leprechaun blarney that will be very much in evidence today.

I'm descended from the latter. My grandmother was born on the ship coming over.
I realize the contributions the Ulster-Irish bestowed onto America, as I do those of the Catholic-Irish, who, by the way, were emigrating to America in the 18th century along with other Europeans.
You though, I suspect, have a bit of hostility towards the Catholic-Irish. Is it that pesky Catholicism of theirs or the fact that they've outshone their northern brothers and sisters here in the USA? :^)

[PotatoHeadMick]

“or the fact that they’ve outshone their northern brothers and sisters here in the USA?”

Have they indeed? That’s news to me and most other people who know American history, there have been almost ten times as many US presidents of Ulster stock than Catholic Irish descent, the Ulster Scots have dominated the military, political, cultural and musical history of America for almost three centuries, not sure a few bars in Boston counts in the same league.

Just for the record I’m a Catholic Irishman myself.

Top o’ the mornin’ to ye.

[jla]

there have been almost ten times as many US presidents of Ulster stock than Catholic Irish descent

Ahh yes, but quantity does not equal quality. I'll give you Clinton and Carter, we're happy with Reagan, Madison and Washington.

Just for the record I’m a Catholic Irishman myself.

Good. Be sure to attend Mass today...and maybe also confession for you. :^)

Top o’ the mornin’ to ye.

Sorry, I don't speak Oirish.

[PotatoHeadMick]

Reagan despite his name was half Ulster Scots, Madison and Washington to the best of my knowledge hadn’t a drop of Irish blood in them, Grant, Nixon, Teddy Roosevelt, Wilson, Jackson and Jefferson were Ulstermen.

Kennedy was one of your boys, not looking so good now is it?

I’ll throw in Davy Crockett, Jefferson Davis, George Patton, Hank Williams, Stonewall Jackson, Dolly Parton, Jimmy Stewart, Jim Bowie, Mark Twain, JEB Stuart, Johnny Cash, Arnold Palmer, Omar Bradley, Eddie Cochran, Hunter S Thompson, Stephen King, Merle Haggard, Johnny Carson, Kit Carson, Robert Mitchum, Audy Murphy, Edgar Allen Poe, Don Williams and almost half the signatories of the Declaration of Independence as well as the fellow who printed it.

That’s just off the top of my head by the way, I could probably fill half a dozen pages of names if you wanted but there’s no need for that is there?

I think we can safely dispose of the ridiculous notion that the Scots Irish have been eclipsed in the US by the overwhelming wealth of talent produced by the Catholic Irish famine emigrants of the nineteenth century.

[jla]

Madison and Washington to the best of my knowledge hadn’t a drop of Irish blood in them

They did.

As for your assertion regarding the dominance of the Ulster-Irish over the Catholic-Irish in America anyone wishing to know the truth can Google 'Irish Catholics in America' or some similar terms. I don't dispute the successes of the U-Is, I just know those of the C-Is are more prominent.

(and leave JFK out of this! LOL - I'm not referring to that crowd up in Massachusetts)

[PotatoHeadMick]

No, I’m not going to get in a pissing match with you, if you want to live in a fantasy land where Irish Catholics have had more influence on American history, society and culture than the Ulster Scots well good luck to you, enjoy St Patrick’s Day.

Slainte!

[jla]

I’m not going to get in a pissing match with you, if you want to live in a fantasy land...

LOL - Yeah, I'd say that you've Irish in you. The Irish are masters of using the 'purposeful contradiction' to make their point.
Take care, Mick. I meant no offense.

...I'm going to go outside now and see if I can still piss over the house roof. ;^)

[PotatoHeadMick]

All the best, I enjoyed our debate I look forward to the next one, hope you have a great day (but mine is still bigger than yours ;-0).

Erin Go Bragh!

[Eye of Unk]

The Obama show has jumped the shark, like a worn out sitcom they are trying gimmicks to bring their ratings back, heck Mork and Mindy or The Brady Bunch was better.

[joseph20]

This is one of those very rare days that we get to openly celebrate White heritage/ethnicity/culture.

[Zionist Conspirator]

For all you partisans of Irish nationalism, a few links:

Ancient Order of Hibernians (American Irish Democrats)

Social Democratic and Labour Party. (Main Catholic/nationalist organization in Northern Ireland)

Irish Northern Aid Committee (Sinn Fein's American front)

Sinn Fein (political front of the Provisional IRA)

Republican Sinn Fein (political front of the Continuity IRA)

32 County Sovereignty Movement (political front of the Real/True/Dissident/New IRA)

Workers Party (What's left of the original Sinn Fein, former political front of the defunct Official IRA).

Irish Republican Socialist Movement (Political front of the Irish National Liberation Army)

Workers Solidarity Movement (Irish anarchist organization)

You would think an ancient chr*stian country like Ireland would somewhere or other be able to produce a right wing nationalist movement, but it seems every single Irish nationalist movement in existence is Communist. Of course, the Irish are no worse than the other Celts.

What's with this mixing of Marxism and "blood and soil" nationalism? Whatever happened to the de-nationalized worldwide workers republic???