Lawmakers seek new gun legislation: Ammo control laws

examiner.com ^ | January 27, 2009 | Jim Kouri

[neverdem]

by Jim Kouri, Law Enforcement Examiner

"Gun control fanatics, frustrated in their attempts to impose severely restrictive regulations on the gun rights of law-abiding American citizens, apparently think that if they push severe restrictions on ammunition acquisition and possession, they'll come closer to their objective of restricting if not eliminating the individual Second Amendment civil right to keep and bear arms," says John M. Snyder, named Washington's senior gun rights activist.

With a liberal Democrat now sitting in the Oval Office and both houses of the US Congress boasting Democrat majorities, lawmakers in Washington, DC and around the country are displaying renewed interest in gun control legislation, according to sources within both law enforcement and gun owner rights communities.

"Ever since the so-called 'Beltway Sniper' case in 2001, there's been talk about not just gun registration, but ammo registration. This will make it mandatory for manufacturers of firearms ammunition to number every cartridge they make and to keep records of those cartridges," said Lt. Steven Rodgers, a cop in New Jersey.

"Can't control guns? Well, they'll control the ammunition," he added during an interview with NewswithViews.com.

While a federal law is being considered by proponents of such laws, gun owners in individual states are witnessing what's referred to as Ammunition Accountability Acts being pushed through they're state legislatures by impatient lawmakers.

Ammunition Accountability, a liberal gun control organization, has developed sample legislation to achieve its purposes and reports that versions of it have been introduced in the legislatures of Alabama, Arizona, California, Connecticut, Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Kentucky, Maryland, Mississippi, Missouri, New Jersey, New York, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Tennessee and Washington, according to John Snyder.

While state legislatures differ in the wording of their proposed laws, basically they all require that any and all ammunition be encoded by the manufacturer and they will maintain a mandatory data base of all ammunition sales.

"We of the Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms oppose this backdoor approach to gun control," stated Snyder, an official with that gun rights group.

The sample legislation would stipulate that, “each year in the United States, more than 30 percent of all homicides that involve a gun go unsolved; handgun ammunition accounts for 80 percent of all ammunition sold in the United States; current technology for matching a bullet used in a crime to the gun that fired it has worked moderately well for years, but presupposes that the weapon was recovered by law enforcement;” and “bullet coding is a new and effective way for law enforcement to quickly identify persons of interest in gun crime investigations.”

"If this new proposed Ammo Accountability Act legislation is only another attempt to chip away at the 2nd Amendment, it is just plain wrong. Since the 2nd Amendment defines a citizens "right" to defend themselves, with a gun, it clearly does not address ammunition. What a novel way to "back door" the issue" said Josephine County, Oregon's Sheriff Gil Gilbertson.

"It is clearly no secret, many in our government would like to see America disarmed. Our government has authored books mapping out a strategy on how to do just that. Simply look back in history to see what happened after people lost their arms and ability to defend themselves," he told NewswithViews.com.

"Our government leaders slash funding in support of law enforcement throughout America, leaving our citizens more vulnerable - but on the other hand feel compelled to send hundreds of millions of dollars, each year, to enhance police in foreign Countries. Weaker law enforcement coupled with escalating crime is a receipt for disaster," said the career lawman.

Ammunition coding technology works by laser etching the back of each bullet with an alpha-numeric serial number. Then when a customer purchases a box of, for example, 9mm cartridges, the box of ammunition and the bullets’ coding numbers would be connected to the purchaser in a statewide or national database.

The code on the bullet can be read with a simple magnifying glass and then be run through a statewide or national database to determine who purchased the ammunition and where.

The rationale being used by proponents of such laws is that cartridges can be used to trace a gun owner who committed a crime such as murder or assault with a deadly weapon, according to the National Association for Gun Rights' Executive Director Dudley Brown.

< http://www.nationalgunrights.org/index.shtml >

But opponents of ammo registration laws counter that this will only increase the incidents of criminals collecting spent cartridges and depriving police of other evidence such as fingerprints on a cartridge left at the crime scene.

"NAGR's strategy is simple: make the enemies of our firearms freedoms pay for every inch. While many so-called "gun rights groups" work to curry favor with politicians and the media, NAGR is working aggressively to hold politicians accountable and to put a stop to gun control," said Brown.

At the federal level, H.R. 408 introduced by Rep. Robert Andrews (D-NJ) a new law would require firearms manufacturers to provide ballistics information on all new firearms to BATF, which would retain the information in a National Firearms Ballistics Database. Critics claim part of this bill will be used to mandate encoding ammunition, which is part and parcel of "ballistics" information.

"[Lawmakers] should ignore the media hype on the firearms issue and pay attention to what the public – their constituents – are saying on the matter,” gun rights expert John M. Snyder stated.

“According to an August poll conducted by Zogby International for Associated Television News, the American public rejects the notion that new gun control laws are needed by a two-to-one margin,” Snyder continued.

“Maybe the House of Representatives should have taken a reading of public opinion on this issue before rushing headlong without a roll call vote to pass a bill before the recess,” said Snyder, who is a firearms advisor for the National Association of Chiefs of Police. < http://www.expertclick.com/NewsReleaseWire/default.cfm?Action=ViewMyNews&NRWID=6042 >

It would provide that, after a specific date, all handgun and “assault weapon” ammunition manufactured or sold in the state shall be coded by the manufacturer, and would include a list of all calibers covered by the coding requirement. It would mandate the disposal by a certain date of all non-coded ammunition listed, whether owned by private citizens or retail outlets.

[Screaming_Gerbil]

Here's an upbeat, encouraging statistic: There are approx. 600,000 armed government agents in America. There are approx. 60,000,000 gun owners in America.

Yeah but...

We all have our own full-time jobs. Their full-time job is training for and carrying out whatever they are told to do.

Also though we are many in number, we are spread out. They are organized and come in groups. And have lots of seriou toys and training - all paid for by our tax dollars, I might add...

[Trailerpark Badass]

I’m going to have to get over my nervousness of guns pronto.

Um, does your hammer make you nervous?

[Randy Larsen]

I LOVE IT!

We will succumb only when OUR military turns against us!

Not likely...

[Starfleet Command]

Yeah but...

We all have our own full-time jobs. Their full-time job is training for and carrying out whatever they are told to do.

Also though we are many in number, we are spread out. They are organized and come in groups. And have lots of serious toys and training - all paid for by our tax dollars, I might add...

If only 1% of us only shoot once, and take out 1 of them, they are *all gone*.

Let that sink in. 1%, 1 shot, once. We'll never have odds that favorable to our success again.

[Randy Larsen]

The Russians were scared to try, why would anyone else think it’s worth a try!

[umgud]

That's a completely ridiculous assumption. More like 4 million, tops.

Actually, I was just being facetious in tagging onto another poster's comment. Having said that, I've heard there are roughly 80 million gun owners in the US. And while I can't verify that number, I'd sure guess that far more than 4 million gun owners voted for Obama. I do however, agree with you that they will soon be pretty saddened they did so.

[Randy Larsen]

It’s too late for them to try this foolishness!

We’re already locked and ready!

[neverdem]

i'm a new york city cop. what the hell is a "chief at a New York City housing project"?

that does not exist.

It did. On his Web site, Rudy Giuliani claims that he grew New York City's police force by 12,000 officers between his inauguration as mayor in January 1994 and mid-2000. That's just not true. Most of the cops he's counting – 7,100 to be exact – were already housing or transit police who were simply folded into the New York Police Department. The merger of the departments didn't increase the number of police in the city at all.

[BBell]

The beltway sniper also fired his weapon from a concealed position, as in the trunk of a car. I doubt he had to use too much effort to pickup his spent brass.

[Starfleet Command]

The Russians were scared to try, why would anyone else think it’s worth a try!

The Russians may be a lot of things, but "stupid" ain't one of them. On the other hand, have you ever gotten an up-close look at the Obama supporters? If being stupid is a virtue, these people are saints. They aspire to double digit IQs.

They will not show the restraint or wisdom that the USSR did. Think Zimbabwe, not Moscow. Remember, Obama isn't a seasoned general or a successful achiever. He's just a narcissist commie lawyer burnout, and Pelosi/Schumer/Reid are no better. They are communist ideologues who genuinely believe that they must serve humanity by ruling it with an iron fist. And they are stupid and evil enough to get their proxies and zombies to try to disarm the only people who stand in their way: Us.

[DuncanWaring]

I believe 90% of gun owners will fold.

You may very well be right.

But even if 99% of gun owners fold, and half of the remaining 1% go out quick in a "blaze of glory", that still leaves roughly a half-million heavily-armed, highly-competent and implacably pissed-off gun owners.

John Ross claims in Unintended Consequences that the IRA, which kept Northern Ireland in chaos for decades, never numbered more than about 200.

[philman_36]

"Can't control guns? Well, they'll control the ammunition," he added during an interview with NewswithViews.com.
Talk about making the hairs stand up on the back of your neck...
Can't take your guns, we'll control the Ammo (F5 repeatedly until it comes up)

[wastedyears]

Those guys with start-of-the-art stuff vs me with a Garand, and I’ve never fired one before.

I’d put my money on myself.

[RebelTex]

bttt

[El Gato]

Eff that! How do you mandate The destruction of legal private property?

Er, hum, by making it illegal. IOW, contraband.

I'll give 'em my ammunition, bullets first.

[El Gato]

The very idea of the power and the right of the people to establish government presupposes the duty of every individual to obey the established government ... George Washington

Sure but the established government has rules. One of them is "...the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed". The Usurpers think they can ignore that rule, and others as well, but they might find out differently. The reason for that rule is to see that the government doesn't violate the rules, too much anyway.

[El Gato]

They are organized and come in groups. And have lots of seriou toys and training - all paid for by our tax dollars, I might add...

True, but there is no way they can maintain 300-500 meter (or larger) sterile zones around a sufficient number of politicians and their appointees to not "discourage" the others.

[neverdem]

Thanks for the link.

[Smokin' Joe]

IMR 4227 is the only powder which can be used in all three (pistol, rifle, and shotshell), iirc., but you have to have the loads right and the selection of calibers and bullet weights is pretty limited.

A person might be able to switch powders and bullets between, say, 115 gr fmj 9mm rounds from different lots to confuse things, but that will only mean all three lots will show up--case, powder, and bullet, and all three would be held accountable for the crime.

Best to just stop this crap from becoming law.

[Ancesthntr]

It would mandate the disposal by a certain date of all non-coded ammunition listed, whether owned by private citizens or retail outlets.

They want ammo disposed of? Really?

Ancient Chinese saying: Be careful what you wish for, you may get it.