Waco sect leader's mother killed

BBC ^ | 1/25/09

[LibWhacker]

The mother of the notorious Waco sect leader David Koresh has been found stabbed to death at the house of a sister in Texas, police say.

Bonnie Clark Halderman, who was in her sixties, was found dead at the home of Beverly Clark who has been taken into custody pending a court appearance.

Police say they have no idea of a possible motive for her death.

[Sherman Logan]

Is warfare ever justified?

Were slaveowners really innocent people, or were they engaged in a lifelong practice of kidnapping, forced labor and other inevitable atrocities?

You didn’t answer my question. If you were being held as a slave, would you be justified in resisting the oppression, even killing your owners? If not, on what basis do you justify American revolution against the British, or for that matter any war? Would Jews in 1940s Europe have been justified in killing SS men?

If you yourself would be justified in fighting back against your enslavers, on what basis do you deny that right to others?

[AppyPappy]

“s Koresh was a nutjob but since when do we kill kids and women because there is a nutjob in the building -”

Why didn’t they just walk out of the building and surrender to police?

[stainlessbanner]

So read the account I posted of the victims - how do you justify their murder? They did not enslave Brown.

[mad_as_he$$]

Why? First it wasn't the police it was the ATF and then the FBI -with the Delta Force and the murderer Lon Hourchi. They had already killed and wounded several of his people. The Sheriff had already told the feds he could get Koresh to come in. Like I said he was a nut job but I would not of surrendered to the FBI at that point either if I was him. I would of only surrendered to the Texas Rangers or the the Sheriff.

Pretty old post to be pulling up. You bored today or looking for a fight?

[AppyPappy]

I didn’t pull it up. Those people would be alive if they had walked out.

[Lurker]

(remember the part about how he shot what, 5 ATF agents clearly identified, that started the whole standoff?)

Except that's not what happened. The ATF fired first and admitted so at Trial.

Koresh was perfectly within his legal rights to kill those agents and in fact not a single Davidian was ever convicted of anything having to do with their deaths.

L

[Freedom2specul8]

Dang I didn’t even know she was murdered, and thought it just happened. WOW

[Double Tap]

(remember the part about how he shot what, 5 ATF agents clearly identified, that started the whole standoff?

No, I don't remember that, and neither do you. Because it didn't happen that way.

[mad_as_he$$]

The adults chose the way way out. Pure guessing that they would be alive today. Koresh would probably have gotten the death penalty along with a few others for the botched ATF raid. There was no logical reason for killing all of them. The FBI story is bull$hit. It was Janet Reno's poor judgment that killed them all.

[surfer]

No actually Janet Reno could have easily picked up Koresh days before while he was in town. There was no need for Waco to ever happen.

Perfect example of how the drunk Janet Reno couldn’t even shoot her way out of paper bag. A lot of innocent lives were lost completely due to the incompetence of the US government. They could have waited this out.

[AppyPappy]

The adults should have chosen to walk out. It’s not like they could have lasted forever. The chances of a massacre in the open was extremely slim considering the press coverage.

Koresh wanted them to die and die they did.

[mad_as_he$$]

Like I said -they picked their leader and followed him. What is your point?

[AppyPappy]

The point is they should have walked out or he should have walked them out. The women and kids would still be alive today. Instead, it’s like they were waiting to die because there wasn’t going to be any good outcomes if they stayed there. He was Jim Jones Jr.

[mad_as_he$$]

When they come for you and your family at 3 am are you going to surrender to the Obama Security Force?

[AppyPappy]

They aren’t coming for me. They never have.

[mad_as_he$$]

Times they be a changing.

Be safe.

[GunRunner]

He was Jim Jones Jr.

What a bunch of crap.

The FBI's negotiator is on tape telling Koresh's attorney that they should "buy some fire insurance" days before they torched the BDs compound.

They played Nancy Sinatra's "Boots are Walking" song at full blast during all hours of the night, which has the key line,

"You keep thinking that you'll never get burned. Well, I just got me a brand new box of matches, and what I got you ain't got time to learn. These boots are made for walkin', and that's just what they'll do. One of these days these boots will walk all over you."

They knew the BDs were using kerosene lamps to light the place, because they shut the electricity off for weeks, then they used incendiary rounds on the compound.

There's no mystery as to who set the fire, or who the real murderers are.

[GunRunner]

Koresh would probably have gotten the death penalty along with a few others for the botched ATF raid.

How would Koresh have gotten the death penalty? He was shot by agents at the front of the compound while the agents who were killed were attacking the back of the compound. All surviving BDs who were charged with murder were acquitted.

[mad_as_he$$]

The point Appypappy was making was that they all should of surrendered and IF they had they all would still be alive. NOT my position. However, if they had surrendered AFTER the ATF raid I believe Koresh and several others would of been tried and convicted of murder of Federal Agents. Of course we will never know. The emotions of the fire would not have been a factor.

[Fuzz]

Janet Reno was not in charge at the beginning of the incident.