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To: r9etb
Ok, I've gotta respond to this. My perspective is from inside the business: I sell cars, both foreign and domestic, in a new car dealership. The perception of American quality being poor, while often true in the past, is largely untrue.

My belief is that Japanese companies do a better job of managing the press than American companies, and that there is a bias against American companies in the general consumer press, though not the Automotive journals. A glaring example of this, is that in 2007 Toyota recalled more cars than it sold. Yet that news was not on the front page of local newspapers. Toyota did a great job of managing the recalls, masking them as service updates and the like.

There are also Japanese manufacturers whose reliability and initial quality has often been an issue, such as Mitsubishi, Nissan, and Mazda. Yet they don't seem to drag down the perception of Japanese cars.

In the midsize segment, where American cars compete effectively, the most reliable car (JD Powers results of 3 years of ownership) is the Buick Century. Yet everyone assumes it's the Camry or the Accord. The Accord finished behind the Ford Taurus and Mercury Sable, and the Buick Century and LaCrosse. The Camry was tied with them.

Now having said this, there are many issues with the American car industry. Some problems are self inflicted, many are not.

149 posted on 12/16/2008 11:37:31 AM PST by JoeA (JoeA / welcome to third world politics.)
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To: JoeA
The perception of American quality being poor, while often true in the past, is largely untrue.

Perhaps. My personal experience begs to differ, however. While there are a number of things I like about my GMC van, I probably would not buy another: things break that shouldn't break (door locks and door panels, for example), and GM wants several hundred of dollars to fix them. No thanks.

And no matter how spiffy-swell you say American cars are these days, the perception still remains, having been instilled over decades. I think that, as a salesman, you have to acknowledge that perception is a huge factor in peoples' buying decisions.

None of this is to say that American car companies' positions are hopeless -- but they've got to make some really big changes if they want to become competitive again.

Of course, there's also a broader cultural problem that spans American society, which also contributes to the Big 3's problems (they are, actually, kinda like gigantic canaries in the coal mine...). The costly aspects of Americans' sense of entitlement is highly concentrated in the manufacturing sector -- and the biggest companies are probably the ones that skate closest to the edge.

152 posted on 12/16/2008 11:47:11 AM PST by r9etb
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To: JoeA
Now having said this, there are many issues with the American car industry. Some problems are self inflicted, many are not.

The problem with the American auto industry isn't the products. That was true at one time, but hasn't been for a while now. Anyone who doesn't believe that should count the number of American cars they pass on the road vs foreign cars. People are buying American made vehicles. The problem with the big three can summed up in three letters: UAW

Also, it's true that Japanese does not necessarily mean dependable. It depends on which model. Nissan Titan trucks are known to have some quality issues, and the 4 cylinder engine in the Nissan Altima had a couple of serious design flaws. On the flipside, the V6 that Nissan puts into it's Altimas, Maximas, and 350Zs is one of the best engines on the market. Similarly, GM can make better trucks and sports cars than anyone else and can compete on a level playing field in the full sized sedan market, but some of their compact cars aren't quite as good as foreign import compacts. Mitsubishis have had quality issues for years (just ask anyone who has ever owned an Eclipse), and until recently buying a Hyundai was a risky proposition at best. Some Isuzus have also established a reputation for being trouble. Yet despite the perception of Japan owning the family car market, Buick makes a great full sized sedan.
159 posted on 12/16/2008 11:55:05 AM PST by JamesP81 (Let the Great RINO Hunt of 2009 begin)
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To: JoeA
In the midsize segment, where American cars compete effectively, the most reliable car (JD Powers results of 3 years of ownership) is the Buick Century. Yet everyone assumes it's the Camry or the Accord. The Accord finished behind the Ford Taurus and Mercury Sable, and the Buick Century and LaCrosse. The Camry was tied with them.

Now having said this, there are many issues with the American car industry. Some problems are self inflicted, many are not.


We do make some good cars. I work for an auto parts store, I deliver auto parts and help with the stock when I'm not on the road. I drive a 5 cylinder Chevy Colorado pickup, it isn't a bad pickup, I'd consider getting one.

There are some well made cars that do last and are hard to kill. Mom traded her 1989 Buick Skylark in for a 2004 Hyundai Sonata. The Hyundai is good but there are times I wish I kept the Buick, it was generally cheap to get parts for, easy to fix and cheaper if you can't do it yourself. It was also hard to kill, one time it was two quarts low on oil, the 2.5 liter "Iron Duke" engine kept going. Basically, it was a Chevy Cavalier in a Buick body. My father said Cavaliers are hard to kill. I should have dumped my Ford Explorer and took the Buick, it costs a lot more to fix. I love SUV's, I like to haul a lot but moneywise, the Explorer is a lot more to fix.

Other cars that I heard where much the same, hard to kill, were Chevy Chevettes, my aunt had one, I should have gotten it when she passed on, a 1983 model. Not much, but a good "beater car." Dodge Omnis and Plymouth Horizons are like that too.
244 posted on 12/16/2008 10:08:38 PM PST by Nowhere Man (Is Barak HUSSEIN Obama an Anti-Christ? - B.O. Stinks! (Robert Riddle))
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