Montgomery Erasing Gifted Label: Implications Concern Some School Parents

WaPo ^ | 12-16-08 | Daniel de Vise

[SoftballMominVA]

The label of gifted, as prized to some parents as a "My Child Is an Honor Student" bumper sticker, is about to be dropped by the Montgomery County school system......Two-fifths of Montgomery students are considered gifted on the basis of aptitude tests, schoolwork, expert opinion and parents' wishes.

[aberaussie]

When my kids were tested, an IQ of 130 (+/- 3 points) was the threshold for the gifted program. They did have some discretion....

[Pistolshot]

It was 'gifted' in the elementary grades, but the weeding out process was generally the same. Class structure was probably 1-2 grades higher in skills needed, and a lot of kids couldn't do it.

What we saw watching as our youngest progressed was that her learning to read at a very young age(4) prepared her for the study skills she would need later.

Her questions for me are never simple, and usually complex enough for a good philisophical discussions depending on the class.

Math is her banner class. Once she understands the concept, application is a breeze. Right now she is doing 'Honors' physics without the Trig background and very successfully.

[shag377]

I guarantee that I can instantly identify any student in any school district as “gifted” because the definition is the same anywhere.

The requirements are extremely selective, and the battery of tests exhaustive.

The identity: My child.

Think about it.

[dforest]

I agree. Gifted kids now are C students from the past.

This has become a status symbol and everyone thinks their own chatterbox qualifies.

[AD from SpringBay]

Public school teachers don’t want smart kids in their classes.

But they do want obedient kids in their classes. I went to a middle school in the city a few Saturdays ago for an activity and had the opportunity to walk around a bit and just absorb the long shiny halls, locked doors, and instruction posters lining the walls. In this particular school, for example, there are six rules for walking down the hall. Think about that a moment or two. That alone is symptomatic of something gone wrong in that school. The emphasis seems to be on learning rules and how to follow them and less on learning any applicable subject matter.

[Betty Jane]

No special and exceptional are code words for retarded and now, also for the thugs who moved to special ed classes because the state gets extra money and the school doesn't know what else to do with the little criminals.

Gifted usually goes with talented now. Gifted and talented classes are or were for the smartest kids and the kids of well off whiny parents who can't except that their sweetheart is among the brightest and for brighter black kids who still aren't up there with the whites and asians, hence the talented label gives the school leeway in placing these otherwise average kids in the success track classes. If the kid can maintain B and C's in the classes he will still have gotten a better education than with the general school population.

[wintertime]

The aim is “to get away from this idea of putting kids in boxes and saying, ‘You're gifted, and you're not,’ “ said Marty Creel,
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One problem I see with labeling a child as “gifted” is the sense of entitlement and specialness that some of these children develop. As a pre-med major, I met many students who had been in “gifted” programs who were shocked when enrolled in highly competitive science courses to find that they were no longer special.

Also,....in the districts in which I have lived “gifted” children are merely given more work or “enriched” work. What these kids need is **acceleration**. Instead, these very bright children do not progress to actual college level work ( and credit) until their high school years, and even that is limited to introductory college courses.

My own homeschoolers were in college at the ages of 13, 12, and 13. The two younger earned B.S. degrees in mathematics by the age of 18. Surely there are children by the **THOUSANDS** in the U.S. who are imprisoned in government schools would could be doing the same, if the system would allow them to accelerate.

My own children never at any time felt “gifted” while at the university because they were matching wits with students who would eventually be career mathematicians. They had a very realistic appreciation of the **normal** amount of effort, work, and creativity needed to have success in the field. Unlike the “gifted” students who failed out of the pre-med courses I attended, my children where never shocked to find that were not special.

By the way, my oldest homeschooler is a nationally and internationally ranked athlete. He chose to attend college in the evening to study accounting. In spite of his rigorous training, and travel schedule, and working for a few years in Eastern Europe for our church, he is only a few courses away from finishing his MBA at an age normal for as his contemporaries. As a result of living in Europe he is completely fluent in Russian and enjoys many friendships with Russians attending his school.

[Hatteras]

"...and parents' wishes."

We don't care what you teach our kids, just as long as you call them 'gifted'.

[wintertime]

But they do want obedient kids in their classes.
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Ah Ha! Obedience!

Obedience to the state has been the goal of government K-12 schooling since its inception. That we have Obama for president is the fruit of the philosophy.

[bboop]

So interesting to hear the comments on Gifted Ed from parents. We homeschooled our own kid, but as a teacher (currently tutoring) I have attended several Gifted conferences, just to gather data. I have not been impressed.

The teachers of the older elementary kids hate it, because they have to do extra work to make it happen, and they are already tap-dancing. The goal is to go broader and deeper (what does that mean?), but wouldn’t every child profit by that? I have one math student, 6th grade, who has been in the Gifted Math program. He does NOT know his multiplication tables. Of what earthly good is teaching him math concepts if he cannot DO math?

Seems to depend, also, on whether there are spots in that particular class/ time slot.

And, of course, there is so much whining from outside the program to make sure it is FAIR — what does that mean? That it should include stupid kids too?

Just so interesting to hear your takes on this. Thanks.

[wintertime]

had the opportunity to walk around a bit and just absorb the long shiny halls, locked doors, and instruction posters lining the walls. In this particular school, for example, there are six rules for walking down the hall.
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So this institution looked like a prison and they were teaching the children how to be good little prisoners of the state?

When Obama’s Civilian Forces come knocking on the door these comrades will switch to autopilot and march two by two to the cattle cars.

[bboop]

As a tutor, I see MANY mind-numbed bright kids coming through. I always ask, “In your math class (pre-algebra, algebra), are there kids who still don’t understand the basics?” OH YES!! The bright kids are bored silly. And I agree, many of these are the drop-outs, kids who cannot stand school.

Homeschool is so great because you can go at your own pace. One kid told me, ‘We are not allowed to use semi-colons until 8th grade in our district.’ Is that not ridiculous???

[PrairieRoot]

Hahaha. I love that routine he did. We’re going to Europe!!!

[Carley]

Maybe General Shinseki can award them all black berets.

[SoftballMominVA]

As far as my two went - one was considered gifted in Language Arts and the other had a general identification (all areas). The difference in their education from their peers was not really obvious until 5th grade when the younger took pre-algebra and then continued on an accelerated math course of 3-5 years above her peers. I also think they received better instruction in written language, but as far as ‘gifted education’ in the other areas, I didn’t see a whole lot different.

[kalee]

Our daughter took our homeschooled granddaughter to Mount Vernon over the weekend. The tour guide said they can tell which kids are homeschooled,they ask and answer more questions.

[MrB]

are less demanding, throw less fits, are more respectful of others....

[-YYZ-]

130? Wow, that’s a pretty stiff cut-off - probably up around or above the 95th percentile. Seems reasonable, though, if you’re really trying to target the truly “gifted”. There should be provisions for those children who are merely brighter than average too, though. Of course, the system doesn’t do any favors for children who are much above or below the average (unless they’re really slow, in which case they get “special education.”)

[kalee]

That was our experience, so we chose to homeschool. Having our evenings filled with inane busy work was NOT my idea of education.

[Tax-chick]

As long as they don't also have to sit in the regular classes and move at the mind numbing pace of the slowest kids in the class.

I agree. Forcing brighter or more highly motivated students to stagnate is bad both for them and for the class. While some bored children will simply sit and vegitate, others will cause trouble.

parents who like having their kids labeled "gifted,"

I can sympathize, but the problem with having half the students being "gifted," as others have pointed out, is that you're back where you started. Indeed, everyone is "gifted" in some way, but many types are gifts - mechanical aptitude, a sweet personality - have nothing to do with the potential for high academic achievement in an institutional school environment.

Having many students classified as "gifted" may be good for their parents' self-esteem, but it's not an effecient way of maximizing educational opportunity for students with different levels of aptitude in different areas. This is why my original post emphasized "demonstrated exceptional academic ability," a specific kind of "gifted" that *could* be addressed in functional ways by a school system.