Claims of Secret Arms Sales Rattle Ukraine’s Leaders

ny times ^ | 11/29/08 | By MICHAEL SCHWIRTZ

[Flavius]

KIEV, Ukraine — With the Ukrainian government reeling from a financial crisis and internal power struggles, the country’s pro-Russian opposition has been leveling potentially damaging accusations of improper arms sales to Georgia during that country’s brief war with Russia.

And Russia’s leaders, furious with Ukraine’s president over his pro-Western leanings and vocal support of Georgia, have personally weighed in, making accusations of their own.

It may not matter that the opposition has provided no conclusive evidence of the claims, despite weeks of pronouncements that the evidence — once released — will be explosive. The claims alone, which have made headlines, have nonetheless helped to further undermine the government’s authority at a time of heightened political instability, while also roiling Ukraine’s already tense relationship with neighboring Russia.

[Flavius]

find most important industrial military complex vs population nationality concentration ... rock Stalin you have done well

[Bon mots]

This is what Putin is really after.

He will not give up Sebastopol and even tried to kill the legitimate Ukrainian President that he could not control.

Things are going to get ugly between Ukraine and Russia. Then, Poland is on the list.

[Flavius]

always is internal

[rockinqsranch]

My immediate knee jerk is the Russians are fabricating a “reason” to assault the Ukraine.

[JulienBenda]

A Russian thinks: “Ukraine is to Russia what Texas is to U.S.A.”

Just as an American wouldn’t long tolerate a Texas seeking independence plus buddying-up to Mexico and other states, so also a Russian nationalist will not long tolerate an independent Ukraine, especially not one which is selling weapons to one of Russia’s own enemies (Georgia).

To paraphrase two great thinkers, one might say: “History ain’t over till it’s over.”

[FreeReign]

It may not matter that the opposition has provided no conclusive evidence of the claims, despite weeks of pronouncements that the evidence — once released — will be explosive. The claims alone, which have made headlines, have nonetheless helped to further undermine the government’s authority at a time of heightened political instability,...

It's the seriousness of the charges, right? They sound like a bunch of Democrats.

Ms. Tymoshenko, who rarely hesitates to snipe at Mr. Yushchenko, has remained largely silent, and no representatives from her faction sit on Mr. Konovalyuk’s commission.

Yuli needs to once and for all declare if she's a nuevo Puntinista.

[FreeReign]

Just as an American wouldn’t long tolerate a Texas seeking independence plus buddying-up to Mexico and other states, so also a Russian nationalist will not long tolerate an independent Ukraine, especially not one which is selling weapons to one of Russia’s own enemies (Georgia).

You're not justifying a comparison between Texas and Ukraine, are you?

[mick]

Good Posts......ping to keep maps for later study

[SERKIT]

Did Bubba do lobbying for the Ukraine, and if so, are his fingerprints on any of this?

[JulienBenda]

I’m sorry to have used Texas in the comparison. Ukraine is more analogous to Massachusetts, as Ukraine was one of the Eastern Slavic heartlands, so I should have picked Massachusetts, or Pennsylvania, or New York.

I did pick Texas because of size (somewhat analogous to Ukraine:Russia), and due to its proximity to Mexico.

If our Texas, or our Massachusetts, suddenly left the union, like Ukraine left the union, and then it made kissy-kissy with the opposition, then we would be upset, as the Russian (nationalists) are justifiably upset.

I hope that Ukraine can remain independent, but having talked to Ukrainians in Ukraine and abroad, not a lot of them are all too happy about the break-up with Russia. Now I was talking to Ukrainians from eastern and southern Ukraine; bet it’s different, though, for nationalist Ukrainians from the west of Ukraine, like from L’viv/L’vov...

[JulienBenda]

It wouldn’t surprise me.

Neocon/Wilsonianism (really: Trotskyism arguably), will only cause us more debts, and win us few friends, not that’s thats necessarily what we should shoot for. I mean, I don’t care a wink if the Germans or French toast us or not.

The one-worlders/Freimaurer/Francmasons will always pursue their goal. We will have to pick up the tab, and that means our money, blood, sweat and tears for their one-world goals.