Posted on 09/13/2008 2:03:10 PM PDT by xzins
Iraq: Detainee death cases headed to trial
Two soldiers await courts-martial for alleged roles in murder plot
Two junior-ranking soldiers will face courts-martial for their role in an alleged conspiracy to murder four Iraqi detainees in April 2007, the 7th U.S. Army Joint Multinational Training Command announced late Friday.
Charges of conspiracy to commit premeditated murder against Spc. Belmor Ramos, 23, and Spc. Steven Ribordy, 25, were referred to general courts-martial on Monday by Brig. Gen. David R. Hogg, JMTC commander. Both soldiers were members of 1st Battalion, 18th Infantry Regiment at the time of the incident. The unit has since reflagged and is now part of the 172nd Infantry Brigade.
Ramos court-martial is scheduled to start at 10 a.m. on Thursday at Rose Barracks, Vilseck, Germany, according to an Army statement. Ribordys court-martial has not yet been scheduled.
Ramos and Ribordy both waived their right to an Article 32 hearing, which is similar to a grand jury hearing. Both soldiers were brokering plea deals as the Article 32 for two other soldiers kicked off in August.
The other soldiers, Sgt. Jess Cunningham, 27, and Sgt. Charles Quigley, 28, also have been charged with conspiracy to commit premeditated murder in the incident. Their Article 32 concluded Aug. 28.
"Those cases have not been referred to trial and are pending the recommendation of the presiding investigating officer," according to an Army statement.
Testimony given by various witnesses during the Article 32 indicated that none of the four soldiers so far charged in the case actually killed Iraqi detainees, but were nearby when three noncommissioned officers, including a company first sergeant, a platoon sergeant and a senior medic, allegedly shot four unarmed detainees near a canal in southwest Baghdad.
It’s not just that the guy was an insurgent, BHF. It’s also that Behenna was ordered to release the guy.
Behenna has to prove the guy was an insurgent.
Then he has to prove that the orders to release the guy were wrong.
And there’s always the issue of the sparse info we have. Every other prosecution has shown the media/military to be severely reluctant to release details of cases against our troops.
Eager to hear more about the specifics. I think we’ve all learned that the media ignores the defense in these cases, so we only hear prosecution charges. Hopefully, we’ll get a fuller picture of the events.
I read back through my posts sometimes, and I see all kinds of grammar, spelling, and other kinds of errors.
Please forgive.
And I haven’t even been drinking.
:>)
Why is another alleged murder investigation being held outside of our country. This just makes no sense to me. Xzins, I agree that orders should be followed, and murder is not acceptable. This was not active combat. However, we haven’t heard the full story of this case. I am quite curious why these two soldiers would kill a detainee in front of a Iraqi translator. Surely they aren’t THAT stupid.
Also, the article isn’t clear whether Atkinson and Sanchez (the two who are testifying against Behenna and Warner) actually heard the shots/explosion or just were told the detainee had been killed. Maybe they did in the trial, the article just doesn’t say so.
If the released detainee truly was a bad guy/insurgent and can be proven so, it will go a long way toward the punishment phase. If the truth is that they ignored orders to release him, I have a feeling they will be convicted of something.
It is against regulation to follow illegal orders.
I don’t recall any such prohibition against following stupid orders.
But...maybe there should be.
With the info we have, I don’t see any way out other than jury nullification.
We do need more info. I know our people want to trust the Iraqi's. But, IMO, trusting them is the stupid thing to do. That may be the case here.
The politics of it ensures a conviction, IMO.
And if this was an insurgent, they did the right thing. And if he was an insurgent, shoot the people who ordered his release, too.
Hey, x, thanks for clearing up the wording thing. Don't want the grammar police after us, huh Girlene? :-)
Some of this doesn't add up. If the witness was acting as Behenna's translator during this alleged interrogation, why was he standing 10 metres back with Warner? That's a long distance away.
I would like to say I wouldn't trust that translator as far as I could throw him. But with my Irish up and counting the spin, double bounce and roll, I could get that 10 meter distance.
So I better just say I wouldn't trust that translator at all.
Now, before I get on my high horse and begin a long rant, I'll meekly get back to work. (it's the new me) :-)
PS. Anyone want to buy a bridge?
To all the people whom’s e-mail I don’t have.
2008 Democratic National Convention
Schedule of Events
7:00 pm OPENING CEREMONY: FLAG BURNING
7:15 pm PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE TO THE U.N.
7:30 pm Ted Kennedy PROPOSES A TOAST
7:45 pm NON RELIGIOUS PRAYER AND WORSHIP: Jessie Jackson
and Al Sharpton. Both collect the offering plates
8:00 pm Ted Kennedy PROPOSES A TOAST
8:05 pm CEREMONIAL TREE HUGGING by Darryl Hannah
8:15 pm GAY WEDDING PLANNING - Rosie O’Donnell
8:35 pm HONOR SADAM RALLY, featuring Cindy Sheehan and Susan Sarandon
9:00 pm KEYNOTE SPEECH: The proper etiquette for surrender - French
ex-president Jacques Chirac
9:15 pm Ted Kennedy PROPOSES A TOAST
9:20 pm COLLECTION TO BENEFIT OSAMA BIN LADEN KIDNEY TRANSPLANT FUND
9:30 pm UNVEILING OF PLAN TO FREE FREEDOM FIGHTERS FROM GUANTANAMO BAY
9:40 pm WHY I HATE THE MILITARY. A short talk by Bill Clinton
9:44 pm MY ETHICS, a shorter talk by Chris Dodd
9:45 pm Ted Kennedy PROPOSES A TOAST
9:50 pm DAN RATHER RECEIVES TRUTH IN BROADCASTING AWARD, presented by
Michael Moore
10:00 pm HOW GEORGE BUSH AND DONALD RUMSFELD BROUGHT DOWN THE
WORLD TRADE CENTER, by Howard Dean
10:30 pm NOMINATION OF BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA by
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad
11:00 pm Ted Kennedy PROPOSES A TOAST
11:05 pm AL GORE RETELLS HOW HE INVENTED THE INTERNET
11:15 pm OUR TROOPS ARE WAR CRIMINALS - John Kerry
11:30 pm CORONATION OF BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA, led by the New York Times
12:00 am Ted Kennedy closes the convention and PROPOSES A TOAST
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.