Signs of Ethnic Attacks in Georgia Conflict [A war Putin and Buchanan can be proud of!]

NYT.Com ^ | 14 Aug 08 | SABRINA TAVERNISE and MATT SIEGEL

[elhombrelibre]

TBILISI, Georgia — As the conflict between Russia and Georgia enters its second week, there is growing evidence of looting and “ethnic cleansing” in a number of villages throughout the area of conflict.

The attacks — some witnessed by reporters or documented by a human rights group — include stealing, the burning of villages and possibly even killings. Some are ethnically motivated, while at least some of the looting appears to be the work of profiteers in areas from which the authorities have fled.

The identities of the attackers vary, but a pattern of violence by ethnic Ossetians against ethnic Georgians is emerging and has been confirmed by some Russian authorities. “Now Ossetians are running around and killing poor Georgians in their enclaves,” said Maj. Gen. Vyacheslav Nikolaevich Borisov, the commander in charge of the city of Gori, occupied by the Russians.

A lieutenant from an armored transport division that was previously in Chechnya said: “We have to be honest. The Ossetians are marauding.”

The hostilities between Russia and Georgia started last week when the Georgian military marched into the disputed territory of South Ossetia, and the Russians responded by sending troops into the pro-Russia, separatist enclave and then into Georgia proper.

[Thorin]

>>>>>>Was that why he favored leaving Saddam in Kuwait after Saddam took that country?

Because he foresaw that Iraq was needed to counterbalance Iran, and the destruction of Iraq would merely embolden Iran. Which, of course, it has.

[elhombrelibre]

So Saddam needed to stay in Kuwait? Wow, you're way out there. Maybe you're trying to make the case for keeping Saddam in power and don't remember Saddam's invasion of Kuwait. And did you support Saddam's missile attacks on Israel too and his public support for and paying of suicide bombers who killed civilians there?

[cpdiii]

Says McCain, “I would institute a policy called ‘rogue state rollback.’ I would arm, train, equip, both from without and from within, forces that would eventually overthrow the governments and install free and democratically elected governments

It worked in Afghanistan. We armed the resistance and they drove out the Soviets. We did not lose one man. Unfortunately we did not follow up on Afghanistan after the Soviets were driven out. It then became an enclave of Alqada.

[bray]

Pukeannan would have let Hitler take Britain since it wasn’t a National interest.

Pray for W and Our Troops

[sobieski]

Obviously, your hatred of PJB renders you unable to read. Pat has been warning a) that Russia won’t allow Georgia into NATO; b) that they have the cards in that Georgia doesn’t control its own provinces; and c) we won’t fight for Georgia.

He’s not excusing the invasion. He correctly predicted it as well as our response: Lots of hot air but zero steps. Georgia will be dismembered, and we can’t do anything about it.

[sobieski]

Senor I can confidently predict that you won’t go, and you won’t send your kin, to fight for Tbilsi.

[sobieski]

Didn’t she say that the Ruskies should leave Georgia proper, leaving open the ? of Ossettia and Abkhazia?

[sobieski]

Some differences: a mountainous, remote country w/o pipelines. Not clear that the Russians will stay in Georgia proper, and not even Georgians will fight for Ossetia or Abkhazia (let alone NATO)

[elhombrelibre]

I've been in three war zones. I don't think I'll go to Tbilsi either. But I won't be Putin's apologists either. Any way, I'm getting tired of you. You can run along now.

[Allegra]

I've been in three war zones. I don't think I'll go to Tbilsi either.

Well, I don't know...isn't the summer weather cooler there? And no sand? Lemme think... ;-)

[elhombrelibre]

It might be easier to get a drink in Georgia too.

[Allegra]

It might be easier to get a drink in Georgia too.

Booze is legal in Iraq. :-)

[sobieski]

Good for you. No one will go to Tbilsi, and no one is supporting what Putin and Saakshvili did. However, Patrick J. Buchanan once again, well in advance, read the tea leaves correctly.

Of course you’re tired of being unable to respond to argument, which PJB set out well long ago:

1) We are putting NATO into a country that is partially controlled by Russia

2) If the Georgians aren’t careful, they will have trouble wtih the Russians

3) We won’t do a darn thing about it.

QED No need to reply w/ insults, only if you can refute the arguement.

[elhombrelibre]

Yeah, that's true. But then there is that darn General Order Number One. There is no getting around that.

[Allegra]

But then there is that darn General Order Number One. There is no getting around that.

*Cough!* There isn't? ;-D

[elhombrelibre]

If the Georgians aren’t careful, they’ll all be murdered, which I’m sure you’d say is their own fault for not listening to the great and all-knowing prophet Buchanan. I’m sure you were pleased to hear Putin’s Russia threaten to use nukes on Poland. I’m sure you’re happy that Putin sells weapons to Iran and uranium that’s used to make nuclear weapons. And if we’re not careful, maybe Putin will kill us. Of course, maybe people will kill Russian soldiers in Georgia too. Don’t be too sad that Pat didn’t foresee that.

[elhombrelibre]

Don’t ask. Don’t tell.

[sobieski]

Look, I’m not supporting it and neither is PJB. But the fact is we are not going to do anything about it. We didn’t aid Poland in 1981 or Czechosl in 1968 or Hungary in 1956, et. al. It’s sad, but it’s a fact. Moreover, we won’t take the Russians on for their arms sales.

Perhaps you are right. Where do you see us doing something? All PJB is saying is that we were playing a losing hand and as such, we’re impotent. He’s been shown to be correct. How is he wrong?

[elhombrelibre]

He's been wrong on Iraq. He didn't think we could ever win there. He seemed to admire Saddam, and even thought we should let old Saddam keep Kuwait when he took that country. He doesn't condemn Putin, so I think of him as more of a cheer leader or a rationalizer for the former KGB man, Putin. Buchanan is a Herbert Matthews type when it comes to Putin. And if you were right about Pat always being so right, America would have elected the chatter box Buchanan to be our president. Instead, he got about 1% of the vote. He's basically been bitter and eager to harm Bush ever since. So I won't join you in Buchanan worship.

[Allegra]

Bingo. {hic!}