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To: DoughtyOne
I will not give George HW Bush a pass on this issue. He was a major player in opening up so-called free trade with China, and pushed it during his administration. Unfettered free-trade, without ensuring that the underpinning principles of the free-market are met and maintained with those with whom we trade (and doing so through increasing sanctions to those countries who do not meet those principles and conversely, increasing perqs or favored nation status for those who do), has led to a lot of this economic problem IMHO.

What we have been doing is giving favored nation status even to nations like Red China who don't even come close.

Anyhow, as regards the US Navy, again, HW does not get a pass. After victory in Desert Strom he started the wheels rolling in the largest Naval draw down in our history save for the draw down after World War II, and which has drawn us down to levels not seen since before World War I in terms of numerical strength.

That draw down continued full scale under Clinton, and slowed, but still has continued under Geroge W Bush.

Of late the planners have seen a need to return us to a 313 ship navy (total active US Naval vessels) in the next 10 years. The numbers you see on my page include major combatants only, not all the auxillary (of which there are 45-50), which you would have to add in there for full force numbers.

So, if we go back to 1987 when we reached the high number under the Reagan build-up, this is what has happened in terms of full force numbers:

1987 - 594
1992 - 471
1997 - 359
2002 - 313
2007 - 281

We have a total of less than half the ships today that we had 20 years ago.

Our quality is great, our lethality has imporved signifcantly...but our numbers are low. This has been recognized and there is now an effort to build back to a 313 force level.

China of course has been doing the exact opposite in the same time frame, and most particularly in the last 10 years. They are now rapidly building their force level, with new modern vessels. At the current rate, they will pass us in the next 3-5 years in terms of numbers, while significantly closing the technology gap.

20 years ago the Chinese were easily 25-30 years behind us. Today, in some areas they are nearing parity, but remain 5-7 years behind us in most others. Our force is much more lethal on a per ship basis than it was 20 years ago...but the Chinese PLAN growth in that same area (of lethality) has exceeded our own significanly in terms of pure percentage improvement.

These are trends we dare not ignore.

Our economic policies are funding this and similar things are happening with their air forces and their ground forces...using our trade imbalance to fuel it.

145 posted on 08/08/2008 8:45:56 AM PDT by Jeff Head (Freedom is not free...never has been, never will be. (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: Jeff Head

With regard the GHWB, I agree. While I think he was more of a stage setter with regard to trade, I don’t give him a pass on facilitating what took place after him. Clinton more or less carried on his policy, as did the current president.

With regard to the military, I don’t give GHWB a pass either. I agree with you there.

The one thing you didn’t mention is immigration. It was under GHWB that our borders just went down. Come one, come all, no need to worry. Reagan’s tough new polices on hiring and border security were thrown out the window. And this is why Reagan gets blamed for what is taking place today.

The amnesty under Reagan was ill advised, but there was no need for what took place to have taken place after his last term in office. The three subsequent presidents sold out this nation IMO. They should bear the full weight of their treachery. And I do consider it treachery.

Your numbers on our naval ships mirrors what my basic understanding of our naval numbers were. That 222 figure troubled me, so I asked for a clarification. I’m glad that wasn’t the actual figure. Thank heaven.

I agree with your thoughts on trade and what it has facilitated, China’s ascendancy and what that means for our kid’s future. Very few people in power seem to.

Thanks for the response.


146 posted on 08/08/2008 9:11:47 AM PDT by DoughtyOne (We're a non Soros non lefitst supporting maverick Gang of 2, who won't be voting for McCain.)
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