What Happened To Justice In America? (Compean & Ramos)

humanevents.com ^ | 08/04/2008 ET | Rep. Dana Rohrabacher

[kellynla]

What happened to justice in America? It certainly wasn’t served on July 28 when the 5th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals upheld the unjust convictions of Border Patrol Agents Ignacio Ramos and Jose Compean. As it stands today, these two brave border protectors must now serve out their full 10-plus-year sentences for shooting and wounding a Mexican drug smuggler they encountered while he was carrying a million-dollar payload of narcotics along the Southern border in Texas. What started off as simple procedural mistakes by the agents has turned into an unimaginable travesty of justice unlike anything I’ve ever seen in my 30 years in Washington, D.C.

It’s difficult to reconcile why U.S. Attorney Johnny Sutton would choose to seek out drug smuggler Osvaldo Aldrete-Davila, in Mexico to offer him immunity, unconditional border-crossing cards and free medical care in exchange for his testimony against the border agents. Ramos and Compean did not wake up the morning of Feb.17, 2005, with the intention of committing a crime, unlike the illegal alien drug-smuggling “victim.” They put on their uniforms, strapped their weapons around their waists and pinned on their badges, as they had for five and 10 years respectively, with the intention of patrolling our borders to protect America.

[Lancey Howard]

It’s difficult to reconcile why U.S. Attorney Johnny Sutton would choose to seek out drug smuggler Osvaldo Aldrete-Davila, in Mexico to offer him immunity, unconditional border-crossing cards and free medical care in exchange for his testimony against the border agents.

Johnny Sutton is one sick scumbag.
Who's his boss, anyway?

[calcowgirl]

He reports to the AG Michael Mukasey, or his Deputy (Mark Filip).

Here is an org chart for DOJ.

There was a different DAG, under Gonzales, at the time of the Ramos/Compean trial and subsequent backlash.
There has been a big turnover in the higher DOJ ranks after the controversy about firing of US Attorneys.

[Linden1209]

There are some pols who are honest, trustworthy and decent, Rohrabacher and Hunter being two of them. Romos and Campeon may have been bad witnesses for themselves in your opinion however it is my opinion and that of many others that the trial was a done deal before it ever started. Good men were unjustly convicted and imprisoned. How you can be for an Illegal/drug mule and argue you are the know-it-all legal mind of the case is beyond me. It is my opinion you are not for law and order and/or justice, you are for license and corruption. You are a D.C. and D.F. kind of guy.

[Linden1209]

This will help you:
National Border Patrol Council » Blog Archive » NBPC Votes No ...
Click Here For Press Release. By Jerry Seper THE WASHINGTON TIMES Published April 23, 2007. The leaders of the U.S. Border Patrol’s rank-and-file agents have unanimously voted a ...

www.nbpc.net/?p=74

[attiladhun2]

No, I am brainwashed by a concept obviously unimportant to you, namely, the rule of law. And before you accuse someone of being sympathetic to Mecha, et al, maybe you ought to get your facts straight. What you have done is what I expect only from emotion-charged Lefties, that is, to resort to ad hominems.

[attiladhun2]

Just making it up? I can’t recall which one swung at the suspect with the butt of his shotgun, but he did so (and missed), which caused the agent to stumble. The suspect then fled, and that’s when he was shot. Using the butt of a shotgun as a weapon might be justified if the agent’s life was in mortal danger, and it wasn’t, and shooting an unarmed suspect who is not an immediate threat to the agent’s life or to others is also not justified.

[attiladhun2]

If the situation was reversed, and the Mexican police shot an American citizen in similar circumstances, you would probably be the loudest in your denunciations, wouldn’t you?

[attiladhun2]

If the situation was reversed, and the Mexican police shot an American citizen in similar circumstances, you would probably be the loudest in your denunciations, wouldn't you?

[attiladhun2]

Its been awhile since I read the account of the incident that day, but what you are saying about using a gunbutt here has nothing to do with what happened that day.

[Linden1209]

Your response was not intelligent.

[attiladhun2]

And your assertions even less so.

[calcowgirl]

Just making it up? I can’t recall which one swung at the suspect with the butt of his shotgun, but he did so (and missed), which caused the agent to stumble. The suspect then fled, and that’s when he was shot.

The suspect was told, repeatedly, to stop. The suspect would not. The suspect continued to advance on the officer, despite having a shotgun and pistol aimed at him. The suspect was within feet of the BP agent and raised his arms. *That* is a threatening act.

You said, that the the supect "was clubbed with a shotgun butt (where do you find that tactic in any police training manual?)" As I said, you must be making that up because the shotgun never made contact with the suspect. Too bad it didn't. Maybe Davila would have just *stopped* as he was ordered to do.

Using the butt of a shotgun as a weapon might be justified if the agent’s life was in mortal danger, and it wasn’t, and shooting an unarmed suspect who is not an immediate threat to the agent’s life or to others is also not justified.

Oh, I see. Being face to face with a suspected drug trafficker that was substantially taller than you, a man that has just led the entire Fabens Border Patrol station to engage in a 10 mile hi-speed chase, a man who completely disregarded repeated orders to "Stop" while having a loaded shotgun and at least one .40 caliber pistol pointed at him, a man that advanced on the agent within a foot or two and raising his arms in a threatening manner, certainly could not be considered a "mortal danger." Yeah... that's the ticket!!

[attiladhun2]

I wonder if any of you read my original thread. I clearly said Ramos and Campeon should have had the charges against them dismissed, since Avila, or whatever his name is, violated his immunity agreement. However, folks here on FR tend to wax on and on and on, ad nauseum. Its one of the reasons I have been finding myself logging on much less often than I used to. These arguments back and forth just become tedious.

[calcowgirl]

I respect people’s right to disagree on their conclusions.

But shouldn’t we at least be able to agree on the facts... at least the ones that are undisputed?

Your claim that he “clubbed” him is what I took exception to, along with the claim that using the butt of a shotgun was somehow an inappropriate defense move when someone is approaching you in a threatening manner.

That’s it.

[calcowgirl]

Its been awhile since I read the account of the incident that day, but what you are saying about using a gunbutt here has nothing to do with what happened that day.

If it wasn't relevant, why was it the subject of extensive questioning by the prosecution?

[attiladhun2]

It isn’t relevant because the use of a gunbutt as you described in your thread is not what happened the day Avila got domed in reverse.

[calcowgirl]

It isn’t relevant because the use of a gunbutt as you described in your thread is not what happened the day Avila got domed in reverse.

I beg to differ. The transcript supports my description, of Aldrete-Davila refusing to respond to multiple orders to stop and advancing on Compean in a threatening manner. I honestly cannot understand why anyone would even try to argue differently.

[Linden1209]

Ooooooooo! Clever - not.

[Linden1209]

Ramos and Compean should have never been tried and certainly should not have been convicted, period. You can talk forever but to most of us it is a terrible injustice. Since you do not believe in justice, just your version of law and order then for you OJ being set free was OK - it was the law! Not commonsense, justice nor law and order.

[mjaneangels@aolcom]

“If the situation was reversed, and the Mexican police shot an American citizen in similar circumstances, you would probably be the loudest in your denunciations, wouldn’t you?”

If an American citizen was shot, after carrying 700 pounds of illegal drugs accross the border into Mexico, I would, either tell the Mexicans they can keep and prosecute him/her, or be sending him/her back for prosecution.

Don’t try to read my mind, you are lousy at it.