Posted on 07/07/2008 6:29:54 AM PDT by Tolerance Sucks Rocks
Loop 820 drivers stuck in traffic often curse Austin.
They should be cursing their own neighbors.
A long-planned freeway across Northeast Tarrant County was blocked almost 20 years ago by hostile residents, pushing an extra 80,000 cars a day onto Loop 820 for years to come and creating the worst traffic bottleneck in North Texas.
Former Tarrant County Commissioner Bob Hampton, a 1980s regional transportation leader, blames "Yankees" for blocking construction of the North Tarrant Freeway, now reduced to a divided boulevard called North Tarrant Parkway.
From the mid-1960s until 1990, state highway planners expected North Tarrant Freeway to carry traffic from Interstate 35W across Keller and Colleyville, connecting with Texas 121 north of Hall-Johnson Road.
The freeway might have made Colleyville a major shopping destination with interchanges at Texas 26 and Texas 121. Colleyville might even have boomed instead of Southlake.
But some residents in then-new subdivisions there didn’t want freeway traffic, and voters even ousted council members over it. Some Keller residents always fought any highway, and Bedford and Southlake residents defied alternate routes.
"These people from the Northeast" — meaning the Northeastern U.S. — "moved in and started telling us how awful freeways were," said Hampton, now 76 and retired in Hurst. "We couldn’t fight Colleyville at all. A lot of those cities never would go along with the region. Now look at the freeways and tell me what’s awful."
Hampton and former North Richland Hills Mayor Dan Echols supported the freeway, which would have carried four lanes of traffic between the Keller-Watauga area and Texas 121.
That would have been four lanes of traffic off Loop 820 and the Airport Freeway, and thousands of cars off connecting roads such as I-35W or Denton Highway.
(Excerpt) Read more at star-telegram.com ...
When I moved to San Antonio in '68, there was a highway project to widen I-35(by one lane) from SA to Austin(90 miles) already well underway.
Today, some 836 years later, that project is still not complete. If they had simply given me a shovel & wheelbarrow, I alone could have completed it by now.
I live in Lakeway, and of course, am driving around Austin for one reason or the other several times a week. I don’t find Austin to be fraught with traffic problems, other than some streets which are both residential and commercial. I try to figure out a route that avoids most of these streets.
Here is another example of your populist mantra, “the people have spoken”.
This is about Loop 820 in DFW. The road situation there
is ghastly. Roads to nowhere.
One more reason to love Southlake.
[/sarc]
At least the 2499 extension from 121 to Denton is finally going through. That won’t help east west traffic, but it will make it easier for residents north of Grapevine Lake to travel to Denton. It will be a blessing when 35E gets widened (again).
I don’t like the idea of adding another toll road. I thought one of the major reasons we paid taxes was road construction and maintenance. Cut somewhere else.
Wait! I’ve got it. Construct toll booths around Southlake and charge people to leave. Non-Southlake residents will gladly pay to get out of there. If you want to minize the number of non-Southlake residents who pay the fee, limit it luxury import vehicles. Granted, a luxury import exit fee would pick up a few non-Southlake residents, but it certainly wouldn’t miss anyone with a Southlake address (don’t they have an ordinance against parking Fords, Chevys, and Dodges in public?).
If this sounds unfair to Southlake residents, it’s not. A simple exit fee probably won’t restrain Southlake residents (especially if they can use toll tags), but it would provide them with hours of discussion over drinks at the football and soccer fields, watching their kids practice. See, it’s really a benefit. Persuade them that only the best, most affluent burbs have exit fees and that the Park Cities are considering a higher exit fee than Southlake. Upon hearing that the Park Cities might beat them out, someone in Southlake will start a campaign to raise fee even higher.
We could raise enough to widen 820 without a toll.
Dallas has improved greatly over the last two decades which speaks to the nightmare it was, but Fort Worth has degraded. With the exception of I-30 through downtown, very little has changed in FW. Now that the whole city is afloat in Gas drilling dollars, perhaps they will be willing to make some progress. Previously, the people of Tarrant county made a conscious effort to ‘not become Dallas’ and weren’t growth friendly, but the growth happened anyway. Now they have the traffic problems that Dallas had 20 years ago.
On any Interstate Highway and State Highway from East Tarrant County to all of Dallas County, if one chooses to stay on one designated highway he will at various times cross multiple lanes of traffic to continue on that given highway.
At various points in the two counties, there will two pairs of up to three lanes of traffic each, crossing each other so as to stay on the same highway. Add the opposing traffic flow and the lanes involved is doubled for one intersection of two highways.
No! No! No!
The problem is everybody is trying to get out of Irving... they are all moving to Southlake, Keller, and, if they are really smart, Grapevine.
Grapevine is the cultural center of the universe. My daughter lives there but won’t give me her address for fear I would visit her.
Meanwhile in Irving, the multi-cultural center of the Universe, one cannot sell one’s house because everyone else is selling theirs.
I used to work near Lake Worth - coming in from the
north on 35W was a problem at the 820 interchange, and
820 is always a mess through the Midcities. Some of my
colleagues came in from Plano - commute from hell!
I suppose now all new roads will be toll. 121 and the
NE(?) Expressway are the wave of the future.
Of course I now leave at 530 am to get to Redmond before
I90W/405N/520 become gridlocked - everyplace has problems.
All that weaving can cause some pretty nasty traffic jams and accidents, I bet.
I blame Yankees for part of the problem also. Just for a different reason. (oH! Let’s not forget the damn Californians)
Sounds like you’ve got some Southlake Envy going on.
ROTF - Now that's a Southlake centric view of the world.
I would call it more Southlake amusement.
If satire and jokes mean envy, I must really envy Gore and the rest of the left wing.
Well, living in Keller and driving through Southlake every day to and from work, I might have a “southlake centric” view of the world. LOL. Honestly I think the Keller/Southlake/Grapevine area is a very nice area, and for the most part the local authorities in conjunction with the state highway department are doing a decent job of accommodating the massive increase in traffic that resulted from the tremendous growth of the area. There are some things I’d like to see done differently, but overall they are doing a decent job. I also am amused at some of the hate for Southlake that the surrounding areas have. The more vitriolic that comments I hear about Southlake, the more likely it is to be from envy of the growth and success the community has enjoyed.
I reserve more disdain for Flower Mound, where I live at least until all kids are out of high school. Some Flower Mound gems...
Central Market, which is the type of high end grocery store that would be perfect for Flower Mound (Southlake has one, BTW) was blocked because of the Flower Mound urban forest.
Huh? What “urban forest?” I finally figured out they were talking about the vacant lot behind the Stop ‘N Go. Flower Mound probably has more tree huggers per capita than Austin.
There’s been plenty of opposition to the expansion of 2499, which is desperately needed. It’s finally going through because the surrounding communities showed sanity. Plus, 35E is going to double in size from 635 to Denton.
There are groups fighting to halt drilling the eastern end of the Barnett Shale (NIMBY). Once the drilling’s done, it’s going to be hard to even know there’s a gas well, but a couple of years of inconvenience is more than some can accept, even if it means giving up a royalty check of several thousand dollars.
I’ve been involved with two non-profits who built buildings in Flower Mound and through I had good relations with the key people in the Town and helped open doors and knock down barriers, it was still a nightmare. Maybe it’s that way everywhere. Personally, I wouldn’t attempt to build in Flower Mound.
I could go on. The attitudes do not make me want to live in Flower Mound. They make me want to leave Flower Mound.
I’ve never done business in Southlake. I did have an office in Grapevine and considered buying a building. I honestly think Grapevine’s success has given it an attitude. Without knowing anything about me, other than the fact I wanted to buy a commercial property in Grapevine, I couldn’t get anyone from the economic development office to return a phone call. Frustrated, a couple of us walked over to the city offices and tried to drop in and see someone. No dice.
The attitude extended beyond city employees. It’s not an exaggeration when I say that MOST commercial realtors never returned a phone call. How do they ever sell anything? Beats me. I’m calling about a property for sale and it’s like they’re doing me a favor just to talk with me.
It reminded me of my days in California in the late 1980s and early 1990s.
By contrast, Coppell, Irving, and Lewisville were all very accomodating. The people in Lewisville were and still are, especially good to work with. They recruited us, even offering grant money. We didn’t take the grant money (a few strings I didn’t like), but we did locate there. We’re within walking distance of a light rail station coming in 2010 (won’t affect me much, but it will affect property values).
My stereotype of Southlake is admitedly based on a limited number of people I’ve met who live there. One was great, but never claimed Southlake. Based on those people, it doesn’t surprise me to read an article about congestion caused by Southlake NIMBY, accompanied by Southlake griping. I find it ironic.
I think Southlake Town Center is kind of a cool, fake place and perfect symbolism. The developer for it is from Flower Mound and there’s a smaller version in Flower Mound with a huge one planned, which will include fake canals and probably fake enviromental stuff, though perfect symbolism.
I certainly don’t envy Southlake. In fact, I don’t envy much period. I do aspire. My aspirations probably lead me towards Hickory Creek or Copper Canyon, not Southlake. I want to live in a home without an HOA. That’s hardly possible in Southlake or Flower Mound.
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