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A McCain flip-flop on immigration?
Baltimore Sun ^ | June 20th | Rick Pearson

Posted on 06/21/2008 9:19:40 AM PDT by Halfmanhalfamazing

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To: Ben Ficklin
And yes Virginia, there were enough votes on the House floor to pass CIRA.

As someone who was involved in it, we will agree to disagree.

121 posted on 06/21/2008 2:17:19 PM PDT by kabar
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To: WilliamReading
Do you know why McCain is the GOP candidate?

Hispanic Republicans (Cubans) voted for him en masse, and against Romney in Florida.

And Mike Huckabee's man-crush for MacCain had nothing to do with it? {/sarcasm}

122 posted on 06/21/2008 2:18:22 PM PDT by E. Cartman (Just say "No" to mug-whores.)
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To: kabar
McCain will put pressure on the RINOs in Congress to vote for the bill.

Which is precisely why I fear President Obama a whole lot less than President MacCain. GOP senators and congressmen will know to oppose anything proposed by President Obama. But, they'll rubber stamp anything President Crypt-Keeper askes for.

123 posted on 06/21/2008 2:20:25 PM PDT by E. Cartman (Just say "No" to mug-whores.)
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To: kabar

That still looks pretty hopeless, if you ask me. We could find only 36 Dems to vote to enforce the law? That pretty much means that all of the GOPers must vote correctly, which isn’t going to happen.


124 posted on 06/21/2008 2:21:21 PM PDT by Brilliant
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To: HABIFF33
I’m beginning to wonder if that has been the Presidents plan all of this time.

Though I voted for Ol' Jorge twioe, I think you're giving him way, way, way too much credit.

125 posted on 06/21/2008 2:21:41 PM PDT by E. Cartman (Just say "No" to mug-whores.)
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To: upsdriver; kabar
I attended a CATO meeting on Wednesday that had an open borders type, Jason Riley of the WSJ, promoting his new book, "Let them in." Michael Barone spoke as well. His remarks were disappointing. He was saying that the anti-immigrant Reps would have to adapt or die as a party.

Someone once said that countries don't have friends, only interests. In the end, the same can be said about people, especially where politics is concerned.

I've been a conservative all my life, but if the conservative movement I knew is dead and cynical political expediency becomes the name of the game, then I'll shed my tears, suck it up, kiss my youthful naivete goodbye and embrace the new underhanded conniving and betrayal. IOW, if there's no longer any truth, why not play with the left to win than play with the left-lite GOP who will only be playing an amateur's game?

126 posted on 06/21/2008 2:29:11 PM PDT by E. Cartman (Just say "No" to mug-whores.)
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To: Brilliant

That was in 2005. The bad news is that the Dems picked up more seats in 2006. The good news is that the American public is much more aware of and galvanized by the issue. For example, the Dem running against Dole in NC is running hard on the issue of illegal immigration charging that Dole hasn’t been tough enough on the issue.


127 posted on 06/21/2008 2:32:08 PM PDT by kabar
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To: E. Cartman
This isn't about partisan politics, it is about the survival of this country as we know it. An amnesty will destroy this country with the stroke of a pen. Everything else that follows is just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
128 posted on 06/21/2008 2:35:53 PM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar

Really! Since Kennedy is now out of the picture, is most likely that the Dems will abandon the McCain-Kennedy compromise next year.


129 posted on 06/21/2008 2:47:14 PM PDT by Ben Ficklin
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To: Ben Ficklin
The issue is not going to die. We have an array of powerful forces against us in terms of amnesty and cracking down on employers hiring illegals. The US Chamber of Commerce has been filing injunction requests against Oklahoma and AZ when it comes to laws requiring businesses to use the e-verify system. They are pumping in huge amounts of money to fund these legal challenges against state and local laws. The ACLU has joined them big time.

The Dems are pandering to the Hispanic vote and will want to repay them when the elections are over. They also see amnesty as a way to make the Dems the permanent majority party. Labor union leaders are pushing amnesty despite the fact that mass immigration is depressing the wage scale and hurting american workers. They see more immigrants as a way to rejuvenate the flagging labor union movement.

The Catholic Church sees immigration as the future of the church. Bishops told immigration is key to the future of Catholic Church--''Immigration is not leading to the de-Christianization of American society but to the de-Europization of American Christianity,'' said Lugo, a native of Cuba."

La Raza and other ethnic groups want more political power. Hispanics are now about 16% of the population, up from 1% in 1965. They are projected to be 29% of the population by 2050. They are registering more and more people to vote and to change their green cards into citizenship. "Today we march, tomorrow we vote."

The voluntary e-verify pilot program expires in November. It is the biggest single tool we have to crack down on illegals. If it is not renewed, it will be a major and perhaps fatal blow to the anti-illegal immgration movement. It matters not whether Kennedy or McCain is around. We are engaged in a battle between the corporate and political elites against the American people. They have money and power against the will of the people. And the corporate MSM are behind the elites.

130 posted on 06/21/2008 3:05:38 PM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar
I'm not saying the issue is going to die. I'm saying that the dems will seek legislation different from McCain-Kennedy.

Amnesty will still be in.

On the guest worker program, they will seek to replace as many as possible temp visas with permanent visas.

Real ID will be removed from employee verification.

Merging the SS and DHS database will be out.

They will try to unionize the H1B

131 posted on 06/21/2008 3:34:19 PM PDT by Ben Ficklin
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To: kabar
This isn't about partisan politics, it is about the survival of this country as we know it. An amnesty will destroy this country with the stroke of a pen. Everything else that follows is just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

I agree with you, and GOP Senators and Congressmen are more likely to aggresively oppose an amnesty program proposed by President Obama than President MacCain, which is the major reason I'm unconvinced conservatives should waste scarce resources fighting for MacCain. Given his capriciousness, MacCain is unreliable as a conservative and we could ultimately lose more under him than Obama.

132 posted on 06/21/2008 4:10:13 PM PDT by E. Cartman (Just say "No" to mug-whores.)
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To: kabar
The voluntary e-verify pilot program expires in November. It is the biggest single tool we have to crack down on illegals. If it is not renewed, it will be a major and perhaps fatal blow to the anti-illegal immgration movement. It matters not whether Kennedy or McCain is around. We are engaged in a battle between the corporate and political elites against the American people. They have money and power against the will of the people. And the corporate MSM are behind the elites.

How ironic that the corporate elite are helping to usher in a socialist society that will probably eat them and their children for dinner.

133 posted on 06/21/2008 4:16:06 PM PDT by E. Cartman (Just say "No" to mug-whores.)
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To: Ben Ficklin
I'm not saying the issue is going to die. I'm saying that the dems will seek legislation different from McCain-Kennedy.

The duh factor Captain Obvious. A rose is a rose is a rose. McCain-Kennedy was different from Hagel-Martinez.

On the guest worker program, they will seek to replace as many as possible temp visas with permanent visas.

There are two main kinds of visas: non-immigrant and immigrant visas. An immigrant visa is the only one that can be considered "permanent." If you give people permanent status, i.e, legal permanent resident [green card], it allows that person to live and work here indefinitely and they can apply for citizenship. The McCain-Kennedy bill as well as Hagel-Martinez provided for that status. It is the normal way people come to the US in an immigrant status. So what "temp" visas would be made permanent?

They will try to unionize the H1B

What do you mean by "unionize?"

134 posted on 06/21/2008 4:16:07 PM PDT by kabar
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To: E. Cartman

Excellent observation, which is why I question why CATO supports open borders. It just allows more socialists to enter the country. Eventually, the very individual freedoms and capitalist system they supposedly support will be undermined and lost.


135 posted on 06/21/2008 4:19:10 PM PDT by kabar
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To: kabar
Excellent observation, which is why I question why CATO supports open borders.

History always repeats itself, first as tragedy, then as farce, and, like so many elites, GW Bush included, they don't think the lessons of history apply to them.

136 posted on 06/21/2008 4:29:22 PM PDT by E. Cartman (Just say "No" to mug-whores.)
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To: Halfmanhalfamazing
I’m sorry, say that again? What?

When it comes to terrorism, who would you vote for?

Other than that I can't really count on the guy for anything principled.


137 posted on 06/21/2008 4:38:38 PM PDT by darkwing104 (Lets get dangerous)
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To: Halfmanhalfamazing

bttt


138 posted on 06/21/2008 4:40:55 PM PDT by TigersEye (Berlin 1936. Olympics for murdering regimes. Beijing 2008.)
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To: darkwing104
Other than that I can't really count on the guy for anything principled.

If Mac were as comprehensive about the WOT as he is about amnesty, I might pay attention to him. But, so long as he's willing to leave the border wide open, leaving us in hock and therefore vulnerable to the Chinese through one-sided trade policies, pushing to close Gitmo and supporting a de facto terrorist launching pad in the Balkans (Kosovo), it's obvious he's not serious about fighting the WOT. Like any other politician Mac is a lot of noise and little action.

139 posted on 06/21/2008 4:48:29 PM PDT by E. Cartman (Just say "No" to mug-whores.)
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To: upsdriver

I believe that’s because many of the McCainacs and Bushbots are one in the same.


140 posted on 06/21/2008 5:09:10 PM PDT by Kimberly GG (Don't blame me.....I support DUNCAN HUNTER.)
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