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The Pentagon's Ray Gun - David Martin Reports On A Non-Lethal Weapon Straight Out Of Buck Rogers
CBS 60 Minutes ^ | May 30, 2008 | NA

Posted on 05/31/2008 12:29:06 AM PDT by neverdem

(CBS) This story was originally broadcast on March 2, 2008. It was updated on May 30, 2008.

What if we told you the Pentagon has a ray gun? And what if we told you it can stop a person in his tracks without killing or even injuring him? Well, it’s true. You can’t see it, you can't hear it, but as CBS News correspondent David Martin experienced first hand, you can feel it.

Pentagon officials call it a major breakthrough which could change the rules of war and save huge numbers of lives in Iraq. But it's still not there. That because in the middle of a war, the military just can't bring itself to trust a weapon that doesn't kill.

It's a gun that doesn't look anything like a gun: it's that flat dish antenna which shoots out a 100,000-watt beam at the speed of light, hitting any thing in its path with an intense blast of heat.

An operator uses a joystick to zero in on a target. Visible only with an infrared camera, the gun, when fired emits a flash of white hot energy - an electromagnetic beam made up of very high frequency radio waves.

Col. Kirk Hymes, head of the Joint Non-Lethal Weapons Directorate, is in charge of the ray gun which is being tested at Moody Air Force Base in southern Georgia.

The targets at the base are people, military volunteers creating a scenario soldiers might encounter in Iraq, like angry protestors advancing on American troops, who have to choose between backing down or opening fire. Off in the distance, half a mile away, the operator of the ray gun has the crowd in his sights.

Unlike the soldiers on the ground, he has no qualms about firing away because his weapon won't injure anyone.

He squeezes off a blast and the first shot hits like an invisible punch. The protestors regroup and he fires again, and again. Finally they’ve had enough. The ray gun drives them away with no harm done.

Officially called the "Active Denial System," it does penetrate the body, but just barely.

What happens when the beam hits a person?

"It's absorbed in the top layer, 1/64th of an inch, which is about three sheets of paper that you’d find in your printer," Col. Hymes explains.

"And it’s hitting what inside that 1/64th of an inch?" Martin asks.

"Well, right within that 1/64th of an inch is where the nerve endings are," Hymes says.

You have to feel the ray gun to believe it, and there's only one way to do that. Martin, who voluntarily became a target, described the sensation of being hit by the ray gun like scalding water.

What makes this a weapon like no other is it inflicts enough pain to make you instantly stop whatever it is you’re doing. But the second you get out of the beam the pain vanishes. And as long as it's been used properly, there's no harm to your body.

"We have war fighters that are in harm's way and you know they don't want to kill innocent people. You pick between a bullet and a bullhorn, not a good choice," says Sue Payton, an assistant secretary of the Air Force and the Pentagon official in charge of buying the ray gun.

Payton's close encounter with the ray gun was two years ago. She was a big-shot from the Pentagon, so they dialed down the power of the beam.

But Payton wanted a full blast and she got it. She screamed and ran away when the beam hit her.

Asked what she thought of the system, Payton tells Martin, "I loved it. I started giggling."

"Giggle is not the usual response to pain," Martin remarks.

"Well, I giggled after I got zapped. You giggle because you realize you’re okay, and you realize that it had the effect that we want it to have," she explains.

The impulse to run the other way is so strong that anyone who keeps coming has to be considered a threat.

"It could be used to read someone's mind, in effect, because you immediately know what someone's intention is. If they continue to come at you, then you're fairly sure they're not a tourist. They're probably a terrorist or an adversary who wants to do you harm," Payton explains.

So far, the ray gun has been tested only against make-believe adversaries, protestors whose rage is about as real as the placards they're carrying. You have to wonder if a more determined enemy could beat the beam.

"I've got several layers on, but the beam is still coming through my clothes so I’m going to try some shields here. This is a piece of plywood. See how far this gets me. Ouch," Martin said, gearing up for another hit by the gun.

"It leaves too much of your body exposed. They got me down in my feet. So I’m going to try this mattress here. It will cover up more of my body," he said after getting zapped.

"It hurts, but I can keep going. Oh, that's enough. So that did protect me, but that’s a half mile to get where I'm trying to go and you kind of give yourself away if you walk around with a mattress," he remarked.

No one gave any thought to using the ray gun when the U.S. first invaded Iraq, but as the invasion turned to occupation, American troops started going eyeball to eyeball with Iraqis and couldn't tell who the enemy was and who was just angry.

Twenty civilians were killed in April 2003 when soldiers from the 82nd Airborne fired on threatening crowds in Fallujah. That prompted an e-mail to the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff from a senior military scientist who knew what the ray gun could do. "I am convinced that the tragedy at Fallujah would not have occurred if an Active Denial System had been there," the e-mail read.

Days later, a three-star general wrote, "Having ADS…" (Active Denial System) "…in the field today would impact operations in a very critical way."

Sue Payton believes this gun would save "huge" numbers of lives in Iraq.

"Do you ever look at what’s happening in Iraq and say, 'We’ve gotta get this thing there faster,'?" Martin asks.

"Absolutely. Absolutely," she says.

But sending the ray gun to Iraq was, in the words of one Pentagon report, "not politically tenable."

Asked what "not politically tenable" means, Payton says, "Unfortunately we have had something called Abu Ghraib."

After pictures of abused Abu Ghraib prisoners surfaced there was no stomach for even the momentary pain of the ray gun. "You don’t ever, ever, ever want a system like this to be thought of as a torture weapon," Payton says.

But Sid Heal, a former Marine who has followed the ray gun's progress for nearly a decade, says the potential for abuse is not what's holding it up. It’s something else: cowardice.

"There's no other way of saying it. You could try to save people’s life with a non lethal weapon and fail and it’ll still be noble. But failing to try is cowardly. . . That is completely unacceptable," Heal explains.

Heal was once the Marine Corps' point man for non lethal weapons. He took them to Somalia in 1995 after America’s ill-fated attempt to relieve the famine there had degenerated into a shooting war.

"It's very difficult to make a case for a humanitarian operation if the only way you have of imposing your will is by killing the people you’re sent to protect," Heal says.

Heal has tried to teach Marines to use everything from sticky foam to lasers.

"A major came up to me and said that the Marine Corps wasn't overly thrilled with the whole non-lethal concept. And his idea was, is that the Marine Corps’ idea of force escalation went from M-16 to F-16. How many people we could kill and how fast we could do it."

The non-lethal weapons Heal works with at the Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department today are no more advanced than what he had in Somalia 13 years ago.

Asked what his best stopper is, Heal says, "Sponge grenade. It’s accurate out to ranges that exceed any of our other stuff."

"You could easily get to 50 yards with this one," Heal explains. "And matter of fact, that’s the longest range right now, anywhere in the world… The stuff that we’re using in the field right now is very close range. That’s one of our biggest complaints."

One of the ray gun's biggest advantages is that it can stay out of harm’s way and still control a crowd.

Sid Heal wants to use it to control prison riots; the Navy could use it to fend off Iranians with their go-fast boats harassing American warships in the Strait of Hormuz. And the State Department could use it to protect American embassies like the one attacked by protestors in Belgrade.

Yet the Pentagon is spending just $13.1 million on the ray gun this year, out of a $475 billon defense budget.

Why is the Pentagon spending so little on technology that could change the rules?

"We don't have enough money to do the things that are the here and now, so it’s extremely competitive. So, yes, $13 million is chump change. I regret that," Sue Payton explains.

"Could you have fielded it sooner if you had more money to spend on it?" Martin asks.

"Yes," she says.

A report by the Pentagon’s Defense Science Board says the military is reluctant to spend much money on active denial until it has proven itself in the field.

"Sounds like a Catch-22. You can't get real money until it's fielded. But you can't field it until you get real money," Martin comments.

"That's exactly the way it is," Payton agrees.

Col. Hymes, who is in charge of all non-lethal weapons for the Pentagon, says the ray gun will be ready to go to Iraq this summer. But it’s swimming against the tide of conventional military wisdom. "The active denial system, being new technology, is gonna have a lot of stigma around it," Hymes says.

"I’ve never heard anybody use the word stigma with respect to a new weapon," Martin says. "If this system could kill people it would be easier to field?"

"Lethal systems have an easier time getting into our system," Hymes says.

"You’re going up against the culture of your own military?" Martin asks.

"Absolutely," Hymes says.

The ray gun has been tested on humans more than 11,000 times over ten years. The early tests, recorded with an infrared camera, were against people in their underwear so scientists could measure skin temperature. Their backs were turned so their eyes would not be exposed. Out of 11,000 tests there have been six cases of rashes and blisters, and two of more serious second degree burns. It’s now cleared for full power on any part of the body.

Some people claim they've been able to stand the beam for four or five seconds. So how long could Martin take the heat? Turns out about three seconds, before he ran off.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events; Technical
KEYWORDS: dod; oldnews; raygun
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CBS
1 posted on 05/31/2008 12:29:07 AM PDT by neverdem
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To: IncPen

ping

If they need good proving ground, should take it to denver for the convention


2 posted on 05/31/2008 1:34:41 AM PDT by Nailbiter
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To: neverdem
David Martin is always late to the party.

New non-lethal weapon lets troops microwave hostile crowds 3 February 2005

3 posted on 05/31/2008 1:35:42 AM PDT by A.A. Cunningham
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To: neverdem
old stuff -but cool
4 posted on 05/31/2008 1:38:05 AM PDT by robomatik ((wine plug: renascentvineyards.com cabernet sauvignon, riesling, and merlot))
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To: neverdem
"Pentagon officials call it a major breakthrough which could change the rules of war and save huge numbers of lives in Iraq."

Why would they want to do THAT?

5 posted on 05/31/2008 2:27:40 AM PDT by FixitGuy (By their fruits shall ye know them!)
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To: neverdem

Hmm... looks like ‘tinfoil’ was an idea ahead of its time. I suspect this could be pretty easily countered, maybe by something as simple as wearing wet clothes.


6 posted on 05/31/2008 2:30:24 AM PDT by Grut
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To: neverdem
That because in the middle of a war, the military just can't bring itself to trust a weapon that doesn't kill.

The "ray gun" is no more a weapon than is a water canon. It's not a weapon of war. It would discourage people from rushing a gate or a building, or in a riot control situation. It even made Sue Payton giggle.

7 posted on 05/31/2008 2:33:23 AM PDT by R. Scott (Humanity i love you because when you're hard up you pawn your Intelligence to buy a drink)
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To: neverdem

They can loan it to the Denver cops for the Dem convention.


8 posted on 05/31/2008 2:53:26 AM PDT by atomic conspiracy (Victory in Iraq: Worst defeat for activist media since Goebbels shot himself.)
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To: R. Scott

“’That because in the middle of a war, the military just can’t bring itself to trust a weapon that doesn’t kill.’

The “ray gun” is no more a weapon than is a water canon. It’s not a weapon of war. It would discourage people from rushing a gate or a building, or in a riot control situation. It even made Sue Payton giggle.”

So, we shoot the giggles out of little Haji now? Good luck with that.


9 posted on 05/31/2008 2:56:56 AM PDT by combat_boots (She lives! 22 weeks, 9.5 inches. Go, baby, go!)
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To: Grut
"Hmm... looks like ‘tinfoil’ was an idea ahead of its time. I suspect this could be pretty easily countered, maybe by something as simple as wearing wet clothes."

Since this is just the effect of a microwave oven, I suspect that "wearing wet clothes" would result in severe burns, as the water traps the heat next to the skin. Two layers of clothes with aluminum foil between is more likely to work.

10 posted on 05/31/2008 3:46:47 AM PDT by Wonder Warthog (The Hog of Steel-NRA)
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To: neverdem

Yeah, but when will they be able to pull the trigger on a water-boarding ray?


11 posted on 05/31/2008 3:53:07 AM PDT by BuffaloJack
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To: neverdem

In a war anyone pointing an RPG or weapon at me deserves to die. They do not deserve a good giggle.


12 posted on 05/31/2008 4:15:20 AM PDT by driftdiver
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To: neverdem
Pentagon officials call it a major breakthrough which could change the rules of war and save huge numbers of lives in Iraq. But it's still not there. That because in the middle of a war, the military just can't bring itself to trust a weapon that doesn't kill.

Let me ask some obvious questions. Save huge numbers of lives in Iraq? Whose lives? I don’t see how a weapon like this saves our soldiers lives. And what is the point of having a weapon that only temporarily incapacitates the enemy with no lasting physical harm to them, leaving them to live and fight and put our soldiers in harms way on yet another day?

"It's very difficult to make a case for a humanitarian operation if the only way you have of imposing your will is by killing the people you’re sent to protect," Heal says.

This is a wrong and misguided on several points. When anyone attacks our troops, they automatically become hostile enemy combatants and putting them down permanently is the only reasonable option.

And our military is charged with defending and protecting our country from hostile military threats posed by other nations. That’s their job, what they are trained to do and they do it very well. They are not trained (and should not be trained) to be humanitarian aid workers.

As General George Patton once said - No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country.
13 posted on 05/31/2008 4:37:19 AM PDT by Caramelgal (Rely on the spirit and meaning of the teachings, not on the words or superficial interpretations)
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To: neverdem

>> We have war fighters that are in harm’s way and you know they don’t want to kill innocent people

I’m doubtful about the value of this device in war.

But I have no doubt at all that local LEO groups are chomping at the bit to have this. As law enforcement continues to move up the nanny-state spectrum from crime control towards total behavior and thought control of the citizenry, weapons like this will be of immense value to them.

They can mount them on the “bradley fighting vehicles” they also crave for their arsenals.


14 posted on 05/31/2008 5:24:07 AM PDT by Nervous Tick (La Raza hates white folks. And John McCain loves La Raza!)
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To: neverdem

Best friggin non-lethal weapon would be one that can beam energy into the attackers brains causing them permanent amnesia, they would forget their very reason of what to do, they would forget their religion, military training and all hostile intentions.


15 posted on 05/31/2008 5:51:11 AM PDT by Eye of Unk (The world WILL be cleaner, safer and more productive without Islam.)
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To: Caramelgal

AMEN! Some people just need killin’! Why would we want to spare an unrepentant terrorist?


16 posted on 05/31/2008 5:55:47 AM PDT by 70th Division (If we lose the Republic we have lost it all.)
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To: Eye of Unk
Just look right here.
17 posted on 05/31/2008 5:58:22 AM PDT by Hacklehead (Crush the liberals, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentation of the hippies.)
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To: neverdem
it's that flat dish antenna which shoots out a 100,000-watt beam at the speed of light, hitting any thing in its path with an intense blast of heat.

Isn't it actually just the sensation of being hit by an intense blast of heat?

..the gun, when fired emits a flash of white hot energy - an electromagnetic beam made up of very high frequency radio waves.

If I held up a large mirror, would it reflect these radio waves right back toward the gun?

18 posted on 05/31/2008 6:05:47 AM PDT by Dr._Joseph_Warren
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To: neverdem
. . . the Marine Corps’ idea of force escalation went from M-16 to F-16. How many people we could kill and how fast we could do it."

Meant as a criticism but sounds like ad copy for a recruiting poster! Semper Fi.

~Marine Mom-To-Be

19 posted on 05/31/2008 6:30:14 AM PDT by ottbmare
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To: Wonder Warthog

You might try putting a piece of tinfoil in your microwave for a few seconds before you field test your idea personally. The sparks and smoking between your clothing layers might prove to be a bit distracting even if you don’t feel the heat.


20 posted on 05/31/2008 7:13:53 AM PDT by 3Lean
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