Darwin's Dystopia : Darwinism and Hitler's Eugenics Program

tothesource.org ^ | May 8, 2008 | Dr. Benjamin Wiker

[ketsu]

Please do a thorough study of the concepts of extrapolation, interpolation and observation.

You have been doing one claiming you're doing another and it's not science.

Hate to break it to you snoogums, but evolution can be observed(drosophila), interpolated(the fossil record) and extrapolated(DNA variation).

Let's think about gravity for a second. We can observe it(mass attracts) but we still have to extrapolate what in the blazes causes it(a gravitational particle?). Does that mean that gravity is "just a theory"?

[ketsu]

The existence of a bona fide skeletal remain does not prove its ‘evolutionary’ heritage or age. It provides a platform on which, however, tests can be made although DNA may be similar in very dissimilar creatures.

In the bigger picture, let the Theory be put to the test, if it proves true, many bona fide skeletal remains will be found, including transitionals, so no fear, right? Truth will out. Meanwhile teach both origin theories side-by-side, as theories. Be scientifically and intellectually rigorous, precise and honest.

Put the whole theory and your premises to the test. Don’t be, as you say, easy.

Okay, let's put the shoe on the other foot. What "evidence" is there for the "other" origin theory. Remember for a hypothesis to be true it has to be falsifiable.

[The Spirit Of Allegiance]

Gravity is invisible, it’s a force yet verifiable and the theory is falsifiable. Religions are belief systems and not falsifiable, both Creationism and Evolution.

Want to earn your way out of being an atheist religion? Show me proof of macro, major verifiable evolution. Show me where it all came from...and where what it came from, came from.

You’re just parroting me and grasping at tiny anomalies as evidence. Those are arguments, not proof.

I have no time for you if you’re not sincere and honest and respectful.

I will be offline most of the day.

[ofwaihhbtn]

I have no time for you [ketsu] if you’re not sincere and honest and respectful.
--Spirit of Allegiance

ketsu has a Richard Dawkins shrine in his basement. He is a devout atheist -- and a real religious fanatic. Yes, his atheism is a religious belief; it is a belief about God (that He isn't there) that he must take on faith (because he can't prove a negative -- that God isn't there). He is just another militant atheist attempting to pervert science with his silly religious beliefs.

Did you notice in "Expelled" that Richard Dawkins admitted that life on earth could have been the result of an intelligent agent? Of course, he meant only if the intelligent agent was an alien race and not God. I am sure ketsu sees no problems with that. Bird-brains of a feather flock together.

[RobbyS]

And you have observed this? More likely the result of your having been trained in a certain social environment —your education—than any “cry” from your genes. But you are free to offer some proof of your assertion

[RobbyS]

What about those who treat Evolution as a kind of demiurge? Sometimes we see the term “Mother Nature,” used the same way. It is a kind of neopaganism for many people. Men seem to be naturally religious.

[wendy1946]

With the single exception of the 30-years war, European wars prior to 1900 were basically gang-fights between royal houses and in 1913, Europe had just gone for an entire century without a meaningful war. Conversely, to find anything comparable to the wars of the last century, you need to go straight back to Chengis Khan.

[Hoplite]

Has it ever occurred to you that meat byproducts might look upon their fellow meat bypoducts with great affection?

Let us turn to the book of Python, Season 2, Episode 12, Sketch 11.

"Sshh, dear, don't cause a fuss. I'll have your spam. I love it.
I'm having spam spam spam spam spam spam spam beaked beans spam spam spam and spam!"

Meat byproduct affection confirmed.
Thread Python quota met.

[ketsu]

With the single exception of the 30-years war, European wars prior to 1900 were basically gang-fights between royal houses and in 1913, Europe had just gone for an entire century without a meaningful war. Conversely, to find anything comparable to the wars of the last century, you need to go straight back to Chengis Khan.

I won't disagree. What I'm arguing is that the scale and destruction of modern wars is due to *industrialization*, the mass production of horribly deadly weapons with much greater ability to kill than in the past. The rationalization of warfare also played a huge part.

It's not like people woke up and said "Now I believe in evolution, let's genocide!" as much as fundies would like to say so.

[ketsu]

Gravity is invisible, it’s a force yet verifiable and the theory is falsifiable. Religions are belief systems and not falsifiable, both Creationism and Evolution.

Want to earn your way out of being an atheist religion? Show me proof of macro, major verifiable evolution. Show me where it all came from...and where what it came from, came from.

You’re just parroting me and grasping at tiny anomalies as evidence. Those are arguments, not proof.

I have no time for you if you’re not sincere and honest and respectful.

I will be offline most of the day.

Show me a gravitational particle.

Evolution *is* falsifiable, here's an easy way to falsify it, put a species(say a bacterium) in a solution with antibiotics. See which survives more, resistant or non-resistant strains(before you start screaming about macro evolution, remember that macro evolution just requires reproductive isolation). If the non-resistant strains survive more then you know that evolution is false(you won't, but anybody with half a brain should get my point).

Can you falsify creationism?

[ketsu]

ketsu has a Richard Dawkins shrine in his basement. He is a devout atheist -- and a real religious fanatic. Yes, his atheism is a religious belief; it is a belief about God (that He isn't there) that he must take on faith (because he can't prove a negative -- that God isn't there). He is just another militant atheist attempting to pervert science with his silly religious beliefs.

Did you notice in "Expelled" that Richard Dawkins admitted that life on earth could have been the result of an intelligent agent? Of course, he meant only if the intelligent agent was an alien race and not God. I am sure ketsu sees no problems with that. Bird-brains of a feather flock together.

Holy moly, seleon was the most ignorant poster I've seen on FR. You have to be the most insane. Are you off your meds?

[Oztrich Boy]

And you have observed this? More likely the result of your having been trained in a certain social environment —your education—than any “cry” from your genes.

Yeah. The idea that human behaviour is purely cultural and therefore infinitely malleable is strongly held by progressives.

However conservatives generally consider that humans tend to behave the way they largely for inherent reasons and social conditioning only goes so far.

On this matter Creationists align themselves with the socialists. You know that "if people learn they are animals they'll behave like animals" nonsense

[wagglebee]

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[wendy1946]

Chengis Khan and his immediate successors killed tens of millions of people. The major technologies involved were the horse, and the composite bow...

[wendy1946]

Evolution has been totally falsified numerous times, beginning with the decades-long fruit fly experiments. When an idea is totally falsified and its adherants go on as if nothing had happened for decades afterwards, then you have a belief system and an unfalsifiable (at least in the minds of the gullable) doctrine and, per Popper, a pseudoscience.

[Donald Rumsfeld Fan]

Gravity and the rest of Newtonian mechanics are theories too.

There are good theories and there are lousy theories.

When evolutionary theory becomes as mathamaticaly precise and predictable as Gravity and Newtonian Mechanics then you can make the comparison.

In the mean time evolution is a lousy theory and deeply flawed.

[RobbyS]

If you read Scientific America, you may recall that we know that the genes are not as determinative as first thought. The genome is very responsive to its environment. For instance, we know that the DMA of identiical twins is not identical, although close. That would explain the twining process itself. A small change in the cells as they divide will produce different cells, which then form two individuals. Further, the growing child is indubitably affected by its womb environment, which itself changes in response to the way the mother lives her life. Life flows down a certain channel, but more as a river flows--never down a certain path. Mark Twain wrote a book about his days as a captain on the Mississippi. Change is the law of life, but what seems to be chance is usually not. There is a constancy in things that often makes us complacent, but also always movement under the surface, so that we have clear sailings or end up on a shoal.

[count-your-change]

Here is what followed your quote from Darwin.
“Hence we must bear without complaining the undoubtedly bad effects of the weak surviving and propagating their kind; but there appears to be at least one check in steady action, namely the weaker and inferior members of society not marrying so freely as the sound; and this check might be indefinitely increased, though this is more to be hoped for than expected, by the weak in body or mind refraining from marriage.” The Descent of Man (1871) p.168-169

[Gondring]

Exactly! Darwin did not advocate forcing the process.

[Gondring]

beginning with the decades-long fruit fly experiments.

Get back to me after your fruit-fly experiments have for millions of years. :-)