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Royal Navy may share new carriers with France
Times Online ^ | 5/18/08 | Nicola Smith and Michael Smith

Posted on 05/18/2008 2:39:19 PM PDT by Dawnsblood

Two hundred years after the battle of Trafalgar, the navy could end up sharing the pride of its fleet with the French. Driven by spiralling budgets, the two navies began talks last week aimed at sharing their aircraft carriers.

The government is expected to give the go-ahead for the Royal Navy’s two new aircraft carriers this week, part of a joint Anglo-French project to build a total of three.

The French, who currently have only one carrier, the Charles de Gaulle, are questioning whether they can afford a replacement and are keen to explore closer co-operation with Britain instead.

“We all have budget constraints and we are looking to see how we can rationalise and reinforce our resources and work together,” commented a French diplomat who is close to the talks.

Both countries are facing a £2 billion shortfall in their defence budgets and the cost of the new carriers at just under £2 billion each is proving a major burden.

The “bilateral carrier group interoperability initiative” was proposed by the French president, Nicolas Sarkozy, at his summit meeting with Gordon Brown in London in March.

French sources suggest it could result in either navy borrowing an aircraft carrier from the other if their own was unavailable as a result of a breakdown or refit.

(Excerpt) Read more at timesonline.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: allies; anglofrench; carriers; europe; france; frenchmilitary; frenchtroops; navair; navy; royalnavy; uktroops
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This seems like a poor idea. I don't think the two countries agree on much foreign policy-wise.
1 posted on 05/18/2008 2:39:21 PM PDT by Dawnsblood
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To: Dawnsblood

Yeah...the French can teach the British their proud national heritage of surrendering when things get tough.


2 posted on 05/18/2008 2:42:45 PM PDT by Drango (A liberal's compassion is limited only by the size of someone else's wallet.)
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To: Dawnsblood
Charles de Gaulle (R 91)

"..Trials and technical problems

Charles de Gaulle entered sea trials in 1999. These identified the need to extend the flight deck to safely operate the E-2C Hawkeye. This operation sparked negative publicity, however, as the same tests had been conducted on both Foch and Clemenceau when the F-8E(FN) Crusader fighter had been introduced. The 5 million francs for the extension was 0.025% of the total budget for Charles de Gaulle project.

On February 28, 2000, a nuclear reactor trial triggered the combustion of additional isolation elements, producing a smoke incident.

During the night of 9 November–10 November 2000, in the Western Atlantic, en route toward Norfolk, Virginia, the port propeller broke and the ship had to return to Toulon to replace the faulty element. The investigations that followed showed similar structural faults in the other propeller and in the spare propellers: bubbles in the one-piece copper-aluminium alloy propellers near the center. The fault was blamed on the supplier, Atlantic Industries, which had already gone bankrupt. To make matters worse, all documents relating to the design and fabrication of the propellers had been lost in a fire. As a temporary solution, the less advanced spare propellers of Clemenceau and Foch were used, limiting the maximum speed to 24 knots (44 km/h) instead of the contractual 27 knots (50 km/h). This did not affect air operations.

On March 5, 2001, Charles de Gaulle went back to sea with two older propellers and sailed 25.2 knots (47 km/h) on her trials. Between July and October, Charles de Gaulle had to be refitted once more due to abnormal noises, as loud as 100 dB, near the starboard propeller, which had rendered the aft part of the ship uninhabitable.

On November 8, 2001, a sailor performing a routine maintenance task lost consciousness due to a toxic gas leak. A non-commissioned officer attempted to rescue him and collapsed as well. They were immediately rescued by the on-board medical team and sent to Toulon Hospital. Both survived..."

The Royal Navy is doing the French a favor.

3 posted on 05/18/2008 2:59:54 PM PDT by Anti-Bubba182
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To: Vroomfondel; SC Swamp Fox; Fred Hayek; NY Attitude; P3_Acoustic; Bean Counter; investigateworld; ...
SONOBUOY PING!

Click on pic for past Navair pings.

Post or FReepmail me if you wish to be enlisted in or discharged from the Navair Pinglist.
This is a medium to low volume pinglist.

4 posted on 05/18/2008 3:00:25 PM PDT by magslinger (cranky right-winger)
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To: magslinger

Bad Idea—let each one build a carrier—share costs and tech but not ships. It can only lead to problems.


5 posted on 05/18/2008 3:07:56 PM PDT by Forward the Light Brigade (Into the Jaws of H*ll)
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To: Dawnsblood

I don’t see how this could possibly work.

Blue/Gold Teams for a carrier?

When the Brits get her back after a French deployment they’ll have to roll down the windows and air her out.

I should not have said that...


6 posted on 05/18/2008 3:15:52 PM PDT by ryan71 (Typical bitter white gun toter)
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To: ryan71
I should not have said that...

ROFL! Glade you did. ;-)

7 posted on 05/18/2008 3:53:41 PM PDT by doc1019 (I was taught to respect my elders, but it's getting harder to find one.)
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To: Dawnsblood

Maybe the two countries could share a carrier and have a mixed crew. An English captain who speaks no French, and a French helmsman who speaks no English.


8 posted on 05/18/2008 3:55:44 PM PDT by count-your-change (you don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: Dawnsblood

I think it is a great idea! The English can use the forward gears to get it to France, and the French can use the reverse gears to get it back to England. Each doing what they do best. ;-)


9 posted on 05/18/2008 4:08:22 PM PDT by doc1019 (I was taught to respect my elders, but it's getting harder to find one.)
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To: Dawnsblood
Sharing a ship between navies is probably not on.

But sharing The development, engineering, tooling and construction costs could work.

A great deal of the cost of a new class is borne before the first keel is laid. Having a common class shares such costs

Note that several nations shared in the development costs for the joint strike fighter aircraft.

10 posted on 05/18/2008 5:24:24 PM PDT by Clive
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To: Drango
Yeah...the French can teach the British their proud national heritage of surrendering when things get tough.

On the other hand, with some limeys on board, a French ship might see its first victory in centuries. All in all, a very bad idea, though. I hope it's a trial balloon to rile the Brits into demanding a more robust defense budget.

11 posted on 05/18/2008 5:28:58 PM PDT by BfloGuy (It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker, that we can expect . . .)
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To: Dawnsblood
Image hosted by Photobucket.com so... the brits get it mon, wed, fri and every other sunday and the frogs tues, thurs, sat and every other sunday???
12 posted on 05/18/2008 5:43:34 PM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist ©®)
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To: ryan71; doc1019

In 1961 while I was in the US Navy, I toured a French carrier and found that below decks they carried live animals for the crew. Hopefully, they were for food.


13 posted on 05/18/2008 8:11:29 PM PDT by NY Attitude
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To: NY Attitude

If they were goats or sheep, we don’t know for sure?


14 posted on 05/18/2008 8:16:37 PM PDT by doc1019 (I was taught to respect my elders, but it's getting harder to find one.)
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To: doc1019

Yes they were. Sort of conjours up the picture tha I have seen of a sheep in fishnets, highheels and wearing makeup.


15 posted on 05/18/2008 8:20:05 PM PDT by NY Attitude
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To: Chode

Yep, wine and brae on tues, thur, and sat … otherwise beer, bangers and mash are the daily rations. Sundays, up for grabs. ;-)


16 posted on 05/18/2008 8:24:31 PM PDT by doc1019 (I was taught to respect my elders, but it's getting harder to find one.)
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To: NY Attitude

And I’m sure these were the same thoughts conjured up by he crew! ;-)


17 posted on 05/18/2008 8:27:33 PM PDT by doc1019 (I was taught to respect my elders, but it's getting harder to find one.)
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To: doc1019

Probably. ;^)


18 posted on 05/18/2008 8:29:49 PM PDT by NY Attitude
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To: doc1019
Image hosted by Photobucket.comyup... then it's rum, sodomy and th lash.
19 posted on 05/18/2008 8:40:02 PM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist ©®)
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To: Chode

You always manage to say something funny. LOL, always LOL to your responses. Thanks! ;-)


20 posted on 05/18/2008 8:49:16 PM PDT by doc1019 (I was taught to respect my elders, but it's getting harder to find one.)
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