Posted on 05/11/2008 6:41:13 AM PDT by badpacifist
LONDON Defense analysts for the British intelligence service MI6 believe China is preparing for the "eventuality of a nuclear war." The conclusion follows evidence that Beijing has built secretly a major naval base deep inside caverns which even sophisticated satellites cannot penetrate, says a report in Joseph Farah's G2 Bulletin.
In an unusual development, the analysts have provided details to the specialist defense periodical, Jane's Intelligence Review, which published satellite images of the base location which is hidden beneath millions of tons of rock on the South China Sea island of Hainan.
The MI6 analysts have confirmed the submarine base hewn out of the rock will contain up to 20 of the latest C94 Jin-Class submarines, each capable of firing anti-satellite missiles and nuclear tipped rockets.
(Excerpt) Read more at worldnetdaily.com ...
Trying to make a point here. Don’t really like stories that are mostly from anonymous sources. But if we are allowed to post World Net Daily stories why not just go for the most sensational stories instead of the less sensational. Credibility is the issue isn’t it? Not only for me but for Free Republic.
Yep...let’s build a naval base inside a cave where our entire fleet can be immobilized with a half dozen smart bombs that can knock down enough of the entrance so the rubble seals the entrance.
“China preparing for nuclear war...”
....well it would just about have to be nuclear wouldn’t it?....nobody could fight them on the ground conventionally....China has 10 million men every year that come of draft age.
Well, I’d say that the Chinese would have figured that in the time that it takes for a situation to escalate enough to lead to a missile strike into the cave, they can get all of their subs out of there, and into the sea.
I imagine the US has a few attack submarines stationed there ready to take out the Chinese subs if needed.
And the Chinese own so much of the US and Europe and other economic assets around the world now; why would they take out their own assets.
I think that happened to Godzilla once. You’d think the ChiComs would have taken note.
From the Sino-Russian Joint Statement of April 23, 1997:
"The two sides [China and Russia] shall, in the spirit of partnership, strive to promote the multipolarization of the world and the establishment of a new international order." http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Central_Asia/HI29Ag01.html
From the Russian News and Information Agency:
"'I am determined to expand relations with Russia,' Chavez, known as an outspoken critic of what he calls the United States' unilateralism, told the Russian leader, adding that his determination stemmed from their shared vision of the global order.":
http://en.rian.ru/russia/20060727/51913498.html
From National Public Radio (NPR):
"Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has been visiting countries such as China, Iran and Russia as part of an effort to build a 'strategic alliance' of interests not beholden to the United States. He considers the United States his arch enemy.":
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5729764
Russia, China flex muscles in joint war games
Reuters: Aug 17, 2007
CHEBARKUL, Russia (Reuters) - Russia and China staged their biggest joint exercises on Friday but denied this show of military prowess could lead to the formation of a counterweight to NATO.
"Today's exercises are another step towards strengthening the relations between our countries, a step towards strengthening international peace and security, and first and foremost, the security of our peoples," Putin said.
Fighter jets swooped overhead, commandos jumped from helicopters on to rooftops and the boom of artillery shells shook the firing range in Russia's Ural mountains as two of the largest armies in the world were put through their paces.
The exercises take place against a backdrop of mounting rivalry between the West, and Russia and China for influence over Central Asia, a strategic region that has huge oil, gas and mineral resources.
Russia's growing assertiveness is also causing jitters in the West. Putin announced at the firing range that Russia was resuming Soviet-era sorties by its strategic bomber aircraft near NATO airspace.
http://in.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idINIndia-29030120070817?pageNumber=1&virtualBrandChannel=0
U.S. Navy Intercepts Russian Bombers Flying Near Ships
Monday, February 11, 2008
WASHINGTON (Associated Press) U.S. fighter planes intercepted two Russian bombers flying unusually close to an American aircraft carrier in the western Pacific during the weekend, The Associated Press has learned.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,330362,00.html
"the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the century" -Russian leader Vladimir Putin on the collapse of the Soviet Union...
"World democratic opinion has yet to realize the alarming implications of President Vladimir Putin's State of the Union speech on April 25, 2005, in which he said that the collapse of the Soviet Union represented the 'greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the century.'
http://www.hooverdigest.org/053/beichman.html
From "45 Communist Goals":
Congressional Record--Appendix, pp. A34-A35
January 10, 1963:
1. U.S. acceptance of coexistence as the only alternative to atomic war.
2. U.S. willingness to capitulate in preference to engaging in atomic war.
3. Develop the illusion that total disarmament [by] the United States would be a demonstration of moral strength.
'Goals' 4-45 can be found here or at many other sites through a web search for "45 goals":
http://www.uhuh.com/nwo/communism/comgoals.htm
New Pentagon Report: China's Growing Military Space Power
By Leonard David
Special Correspondent, SPACE.com
March 6, 2008
GOLDEN, Colorado A just-released Pentagon report spotlights a growing U.S. military concern that China is developing a multi- dimensional program to limit or prevent the use of space-based assets by its potential adversaries during times of crisis or conflict.
Furthermore, last year's successful test by China of a direct-ascent, anti-satellite (ASAT) weapon to destroy its own defunct weather satellite, the report adds, underscores that country's expansion from the land, air, and sea dimensions of the traditional battlefield into the space and cyber-space domains.
Although China's commercial space program has utility for non- military research, that capability demonstrates space launch and control know-how that have direct military application. Even the Chang'e 1 the Chinese lunar probe now circling the Moon is flagged in the report as showcasing China's ability "to conduct complicated space maneuvers a capability which has broad implications for military counterspace operations."
To read the entire publication [29.67MB/pdf], go to (U.S. Dept of Defense) :
http://www.defenselink.mil/pubs/pdfs/China_Military_Report_08.pdf
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Obama Pledges Cuts in Missile Defense, Space, and Nuclear Weapons Programs
February 29, 2008 :: News
MissileThreat.com
A video has surfaced of Presidential candidate Senator Barack Obama talking on his plans for strategic issues such as nuclear weapons and missile defense.
The full text from the video, as released, reads as follows:
Thanks so much for the Caucus4Priorities, for the great work you've been doing. As president, I will end misguided defense policies and stand with Caucus4Priorities in fighting special interests in Washington.
First, I'll stop spending $9 billion a month in Iraq. I'm the only major candidate who opposed this war from the beginning. And as president I will end it.[i.e. not win it]
Second, I will cut tens of billions of dollars in wasteful spending.
I will cut investments in unproven missile defense systems.
I will not weaponize space.
I will slow our development of future combat systems.
And I will institute an independent "Defense Priorities Board" to ensure that the Quadrennial Defense Review is not used to justify unnecessary spending.
Third, I will set a goal of a world without nuclear weapons. To seek that goal, I will not develop new nuclear weapons; I will seek a global ban on the production of fissile material; and I will negotiate with Russia to take our ICBMs off hair-trigger alert, and to achieve deep cuts in our nuclear arsenals.
You know where I stand. I've fought for open, ethical and accountable government my entire public life. I don't switch positions or make promises that can't be kept. I don't posture on defense policy and I don't take money from federal lobbyists for powerful defense contractors. As president, my sole priority for defense spending will be protecting the American people. Thanks so much.
Article: Obama Pledges Cuts in Missile Defense, Space, and Nuclear Weapons Programs:
http://missilethreat.com/archives/id.7086/detail.asp
"MissileThreat.com is a project of The Claremont Institute devoted to understanding and promoting the requirements for the strategic defense of the United States."
_____________________________________________________________
"I will cut investments in unproven missile defense systems."--Barack Obama
"unproven" missile defense systems???
Hey Barack, check THIS out!
(U.S. Dept of Defense video of shootdown of US spy satellite)
2007 Chinese anti-satellite missile test:
The 2007 Chinese anti-satellite missile test was conducted by China on January 11, 2007. A Chinese weather satellite the FY-1C polar orbit satellite of the Fengyun series, at an altitude of 865 kilometres (537 mi), with a mass of 750 kg[1] was destroyed by a kinetic kill vehicle traveling with a speed of 8 km/s in the opposite direction[2] (see Head-on engagement). It was launched with a multistage solid-fuel missile from Xichang Satellite Launch Center or nearby.
--wikipedia: see "2007 Chinese anti-satellite missile test"
Obama Promises to Dismantle Our Armed Forces
by Robert Maginnis
Posted 04/10/2008 ET
(Mr. Maginnis is a retired Army lieutenant colonel, a national security and foreign affairs analyst for radio and television and a senior strategist with the U.S. Army)
YouTube has an undated 52-second clip of Democratic presidential candidate Senator Barrack Obama outlining his plans for Americas national defense. Obamas presentation demonstrates either total naivete about important national security programs or he is just pandering for votes among the extreme left.
http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?print=yes&id=25942
Note: Although I sent Human Events the ORIGINAL youtube video several weeks ago (original: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7o84PE871BE ) and asked that they replace the copy they refer to (copy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dl32Y7wDVDs ), they still have not yet done so. The original comes directly from the Obama camp itself and so is a lot more credible. In any case, Col Maginnis does an excellent in-depth must read analysis of Obama's proposed defense policies (see: http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?print=yes&id=25942).
You did more journalism in one post that WND does in their article.
I agree. The Chinese have taken so much of our capital base, resources, financial markets and infrastructure, what good would it do them to destroy all of that?
It would not make sense in a WWII scenario. However we aren't in a WWII scenario.
The Chinese think it's important to not show their hand, so there's an advantage in the pre-war scenario to hide the numbers of subs they have, and to not let anybody know whether they are in port or on patrol.
When the Chinese pull the trigger (and I think it safe to say that they will pull it, and not us) that base will be empty. And, I think they think the war will be over before those subs need to return.
As long as we are on wild speculation:
So China builds a credible deep-water navy, able to rival the power projected by the US as of 2008. Who says there shall be any will, or even capability, for the US to MAINTAIN a deep-water naval presence in the world, let alone the ability to project by air an injected military presence ANYWHERE?
Consider this - the next “President” of the US may very well be a pacificist at heart (there is certainly no assurance that John McCain would be elected in the present political climate in the US), and call all the US Navy and US ground and air power home. You heard it, just unilateral withdrawal.
Somebody will have to expand into that vacuum. And the most capable and aggressive nation out there would be China. Not because they WANT to, but because they HAVE to. Troublemaker nations like Iran, which the US feels constrained against confronting, will not be cut much slack by the expansionist Chinese, especially if THEIR flow of petroleum from foreign sources is threatened in any way.
If China has bunkers carved back into cliff faces, and shuttles their growing sea power back into the deep recesses while still expanding, the surprise to the world as this fleet bursts out upon the seas would have a stunning effect, much more than parading missiles before a reviewing stand in Tiananmen Square, or an orderly procession of marching soldiers at the Beijing Summer Olympics.
By as soon as 2012, the Chinese may well be able to impose their hegenomy over a much larger swath than they now do in the world. Japan, South Korea and India stand to be vassal states, regretfully unable to do much in terms of trade with the US, and nothing at all in terms of mutual defense.
Probably true, but my guess is that we have satellites that would know exactly where the surface ships are. Perhaps there is technology that also tells us where the subs are. The question still remains, however, that if we seal the entrance--even if they are all at sea--where do they go for repairs?
If it ends as quickly as you suggest, you're right...it won't matter one way or the other. I kinda doubt that's what will happen, however. After all, where would they sell all their crap if we're out of the picture?
The source is no worse than any. China might be preparing for a nuclear war, but nobody can prepare to win a nuclear war.
your saying news media has credibility
im confused
In order to accomodate 20 subs at once plus all the facilities needed to support them, the Chinese would need to dig a cavern a mile or two square.
Well done. Unfortunately very scary as well.
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