Posted on 04/18/2008 6:30:59 PM PDT by granite
SAN ANGELO, Texas -- More than 400 children taken from a ranch run by a polygamous sect will stay in state custody and be subject to genetic testing, a judge ruled Friday. State District Judge Barbara Walther heard 21 hours of testimony over two days before ruling that the children be kept by the state. Individual hearings will be set for the children over the next several weeks. She ordered that all children and parents be given genetic testing. Child welfare officials have said they've had difficulty determining how the children and parents are related because of evasive or changing answers.
(Excerpt) Read more at latimes.com ...
I was not in the least being sarcastic. Ahmadinejad does not believe in the holocaust and he is not alone in his denial of it.
I’m not. I think conservative Christian homeschoolers would be the best place to put these cult children IF they should be removed. Conservative Christian homeschoolers are not like this cult. Any similarities would only be positive ones, like modest clothing, industry, independence, respect for authority, etc.
How many conservative Christian homeschoolers do you know who adopt or have foster children? I know a few.
Far too many around here talk big about caring for the children, but prefer to let CPS put them in bad homes rather than open theirs. It might interfere with BBQ or baseball practice.
But from my experience conservative Christian homeschoolers would be the ones to step up more than all the supposed conservatives here who call for castration, CPS action, death penalty, etc. but are willing to do little practically speaking to help.
“I was not in the least being sarcastic.”
I realize that there a holocaust deniers, But I assume you are sarcastic by calling the holocaust a DISPUTED historical fact.
Surely you don’t dispute that it happened.
I wanted to correct the notion that I keep reading in these threads that some people believe that the law was changed in Texas as a special reaction against the FLDS trials. I never heard this idea in all the testimony about age of consent.
If a special agenda was intended, it was to apply a law intended to protect all teen girls from exploitation by older men. The testimony from girls who had been abused by teachers and then driven to or dropped off at the abortion clinic was helpful in getting the law changed in Texas to require parental consent, identification, and an affidavit from the consenting adult.
It is the proper business of the State to decide the age of consent for contracts which will then be backed by the State — especially such important contracts as marriage. This case shows the risk of arbitrary use of terms like “statutory rape’ and “child abuse,” especially when its enforcement interferes with the family and/or with religious freedom.
a holocaust deniers = are holocaust deniers
too late
time for sleep
No, it’s not “okay” if they are both 13 or 14. There are no loopholes for sex under the age of 14. First, the crime of rape doesn’t depend on the age of the perpetrator or the victim. (The punishment may, however. We passed a law this year to increase the penalty for child rape - a specific crime, separate from indecency with a child, abuse or molestation.) to a mandatory 25 year sentence on conviction and
However, there’s no logic in using the guns and prisons of the State to prosecute or punish them for consensual sex.
The cases that come under the “within 3 years” rule are still against the law, but there is a legal defense in the law.
Your scenario is ridiculous. There were pregnant teens who spoke to the social workers about the circumstances of their pregnancies, and the fact that they were in this community was pertinent. Unless there’s a prophet who controls the “entire neighborhood of parents,” I don’t believe that your scenario is relevant.
Where have I ever opposed the development of truth in this case? I have opposed returning these children to their mothers and for the very reason that would interfer with determing truth.
It should be clear that if these allegations are true, then the mother are both victims and co-conspirators. Allowing the mothers unfettered access to the children will taint any possible recovery of evidence. If these allegations are true, then these mothers condonned and encouraged the underage girls to have sex with the fathers of their babies. It is too likely that they would encourage the children to give false testimony.
It is a sad thing, but there is no other viable path to the truth.
“It seems if the court order allowing the state to enter their homes is based upon false allegations (Sarah) and any evidence derived from that order is a derivitive of the fruit of the poisonous tree.”
Since you’re familiar with the words ‘poisoned tree’, then you should know as well as I, that discovery of body during a search for stolen goods can be admissible even if no stolen goods are found as long as the initial warrant was based upon ‘good faith’. The fact that the initial allegations were false does not mean that the authorities were not acting in ‘good faith’.
“It also seems there are some that would be happy with another Waco.”
What a totally baseless allegation. I’ve not seen a single comment where anyone has said anything remotely close to supporting ‘another Waco’. If anything, it appears that these state authorities have acted far more responsibly and reasonably than did those at Waco. It would appear that had these same Texans been in charge at Waco, Mount Carmel would still stand today.
The reason the children were removed was because Ms. Voss was allowed to interview teen girls while looking for Sarah. She found that some of the girls were pregnant and that others were already mothers. They were “spiritually joined,” not legally married. Under Texas law, they are victims of sexual assault.
Based on this article the allegations of abuse are not the current primary reason for the state's involvement, rather the children seem to be homeless.
If the parents of the children have not identified themselves then the children are essentially homeless. If the children are essentially homeless then the state has a compelling interest to discover who the parents are and compel them to meet their parental obligations or place the children with foster parents because they have been abandoned. Abandonment is a clear reason to remove parental rights.
We make decisions all the time about what is legal for minors compared to adults in order to protect the children from the consequences of bad judgment and from those who would exploit their lack of judgment and vulnerability. The laws on age of consent are based on the facts that girls who get pregnant from 15-17 are likely to be abused - half the fathers are 5 years older: http://www.dhs.state.or.us/dhs/ph/chs/data/teen/412/06/sta2006c.shtml?cnty=sta&zip=c&yrs=2006
http://www.schs.state.nc.us/SCHS/pdf/sb-7.pdf ( pdf)
http://www.cde.ca.gov/ls/cg/pp/teenpregnancy.asp
Good post. 400 children? How many parents committed crimes? This bs needs to stop. If this was some “Back to Africa” type black group, there would be riots in the streets. Since they’re considered freaks by nearly everyone, whatever the govt says, goes. Drip by drip, this country’s govt(s) are becoming totalitarian. I know what kind of custody this is, but just the same, What crimes did the 400 children commit to be placed in govt custody?
and you have all the evidence that all this took place? or are you still getting your hard facts from the MSM?
“Muslims of America” compound in Red House, VA.
Is this the next religious compound to raid for allegations of child abuse?
underage girls get pregnant a lot in this country.. does this mean if there are 2 underage pregnant girls in my neighborhood, I should have my children removed from my house? This is what is happening here.. how about all the households in the nation with pregnant teens, should we remove the other children in the house?
I think the point is rather more how the media has too much to do in misguiding our perceptions of events. Witness how quickly it’s been forgotten that Obama neither wore a flag pin nor saluted the flag not so very long ago.
I know people in our church who’ve taken in Chinese orphan girls to prevent their demise. But many there are not what I would call conservative and for that reason we are considering moving our membership. I shudder to think they are quietly endorsing a liberal.
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