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To: Rurudyne
BTW ... all fun aside, global cooling is BAD.

Under normal circumstances that would be a very uncontroversial observation. However, given the current hysteria over global warming, we might discover that the political benefits of global cooling outweigh the economic costs.

In other words, a continuing belief in catastrophic anthropogenic global warming will have enormous worldwide long-term economic costs as CO2 emissions are regulated, and equally enormous political costs as our various freedoms (including freedom of speech in opposition to global warming orthodoxy) are suppressed.

Whereas a significant and irrefutable reduction in current global temperatures, along with credible predictions of future temperature declines as the sun's output diminishes and we enter a Maunder Minimum, will discredit the global warming alarmists. It will take awhile, and they won't go down easily, but it will become harder and harder for them to maintain that anthropogenic global warming is going to destroy the earth when the earth keeps getting cooler.

If this derails the agenda of Gore acolytes, it may well compensate for the economic disadvantages of cooling. After all, we have the technology to keep ourselves warm. I like living in sunny southern California, but I was born and raised in Wisconsin and I can survive in a colder climate. Improved nuclear power and other advanced energy sources will be developed long before the slow pace of cooling can have a drastic impact on our lives.

26 posted on 02/13/2008 1:36:33 PM PST by dpwiener
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To: dpwiener
As a card carrying cynic I respect what you're saying.

Incidentally, they've already updated at the observatory (the previous examples were yesterday's):
Flux Density Values in sfu for 20:00 on 2008:02:13

Julian Day Number : 2454510.322

Carrington Rotation Number : 2066.717

Observed Flux Density : 0070.5

Flux Density Adjusted for 1 A.U. : 0068.7


URSI Series D Flux, Adj. x 0.9 : 0061.8
We may not have bottomed out JUST yet.
28 posted on 02/13/2008 1:54:32 PM PST by Rurudyne (Standup Philosopher)
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To: dpwiener
Whereas a significant and irrefutable reduction in current global temperatures, along with credible predictions of future temperature declines as the sun's output diminishes and we enter a Maunder Minimum, will discredit the global warming alarmists. It will take awhile, and they won't go down easily, but it will become harder and harder for them to maintain that anthropogenic global warming is going to destroy the earth when the earth keeps getting cooler.

I agree, but never underestimate the ability of the AGW alarmist to lie. Remember there are trillions in $$ and a religion at stake.

Just look at 2007, the oceans cooled (That's 75% of the "global" in global warming right there), Antarctica froze to record levels, and whole southern hemisphere suffered through one of it's worst winters in a century and it seemed every week there was a post here on freereublic of record cold or snow somewhere.

Yet despite that, they claim 2007 was the 5th warmest year recorded, or even worse that fraud James Hansen at the GISS claimed 2007 was the 2nd warmest year (though to give credit where credit is due, even most alarmist don't take him serious anymore)

The simple fact is even if it does get colder, they can just lie. Even during the Little Ice Age there were still heat waves, hurricanes and droughts, so all they have to do is to continue highlight the warm/extreme events while dismissing/ignoring the cold ones and the sheepe will still buy it. Especially if Hillary or Obama get in there, then expect record temps every year no matter what is really happening.

A cooling event like between 1945-1976 or even the cool temps of the late 1800's - early 20th century won't do, it's probably have to take a Maunder Minimum type climate to discredit AGW in most people's brainwashed eyes.

33 posted on 02/13/2008 9:06:41 PM PST by qam1 (There's been a huge party. All plates and the bottles are empty, all that's left is the bill to pay)
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To: dpwiener
Some very good points concerning how a drastic Solar Induced Global Cooling Period might help prevent the Draconian Economic Controls many of the Global Socialists are now proposing. There is however one major overriding factor that will make the AGW crowd more or less obsolete rather quickly. If cooling continues and intensifies, Weather Driven Migrations will spark Regional Wars. My guess is the Chinese will make a move southward. They have over a Billion mouths to feed. Russia will also make a move south toward the Middle East and toward Western Europe. These moves could begin to occur within 2-3 Northern Hemisphere winters if cooling continues to worsen. In the short term the North Koreans may rush south for food. These are worse case scenarios, but scenarios that should be considered nonetheless.
46 posted on 02/15/2008 2:38:20 AM PST by justa-hairyape
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To: dpwiener
However, given the current hysteria over global warming, we might discover that the political benefits of global cooling outweigh the economic costs.

Sad observation. An ice age would be less damaging than letting the little green hitlers run things.

Even worse, if we hand the keys over to the greens, they will make no difference in climate. So we could have little hitlers running things AND an ice age. It's a twofer.

246 posted on 05/03/2008 11:31:46 AM PDT by ModelBreaker
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