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To: Filo; Man50D
Thanks for the thread Man50D, All of us are signed up here.

File, I think what the poster meant was that at present nothing prevents us from having both a sales tax and an income tax. In fact Charlie Wrangle had already authored a bill to try to get support for doing just that. The FairTax bill does, at least, give us some protection from having both since it not only voids the necessary portions of the income tax laws and defunds the IRS but it also requires the destruction of the income tax records. That gives us the necessary breathing space (while having an operational FairTax to provide revenue) to pass the "repeal the 16th" now in congress and get it ratified (It does not require a presidential signature).

It's a great sham - pushed by each and every anti FairTax attack-bot on these threads that everything one spends is taxed and at a "30%" rate. That's "stuff and nonsense" as my granny used to say. To reasonably and fairly compare the present tax system and the FairTax the 23% rate is the correct one to use since income tax is tax inclusive.

Not everything one spends is taxed under the FairTax and that when combined with the prebate greatly lowers the effective tax rate. In fact, typically the FairTax effective tax rate is about half of the effective income tax rate presently so that the FairTax rate will most likely be less than the embedded taxes in the cost of goods and in any event under the present system one will certainly be "contributing" to Uncle's tax take whether he realize it or not and under the FairTax any such spending will not always be taxed but when it is it will be at the lower effective FairTax rate.

If the FairTax gives us another 80 years of "simplicity" I'd certainly take that - that's far better than the present circumstance. I don't know that any of the FairTax supporters will argue with you about the spending, but this is a revenue raising bill, not a spending authorization. And "how they steal" IS very important and having the FairTax gives us the visibility for all taxpayers to see how poorly their elected reps are performing with no place for them to hide and finger point (as they now do) to try to escape that responsibility. With the FairTax, those hiding places go away and allow the voters to zero in on the bad actors which will then be clearly identifiable. The fact that prices will probably also go down is a big plus also, but mainly improving our exporters businesses would greatly help the economy as should having this country be the largest tax haven from the standpoint of attracting capital for investment (meaning job creation, etc.). So yes, it does matter.

74 posted on 02/05/2008 8:37:17 PM PST by baybabe
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To: baybabe
The FairTax bill does, at least, give us some protection from having both since it not only voids the necessary portions of the income tax laws and defunds the IRS but it also requires the destruction of the income tax records.

Which is no protection at all. Although the records may be gone, the laws will still be available. Any congress can reinstate them with a simple hand-vote and a signature from a friendly president.

I could think of any number of "emergencies" they could use to justify it.

Unless the 16th is gone then we will not be at all protected from a dual-tax system.

To reasonably and fairly compare the present tax system and the FairTax the 23% rate is the correct one to use since income tax is tax inclusive.

I'm sorry, but you don't get to be the arbitor of what is reasonable and fair. The Fair Tax is a sales tax and, as such, can only be fairly compared to other sales taxes.

My state sales tax is 8.25% exclusive. The fair tax will be 30%.

Not everything one spends is taxed under the FairTax and that when combined with the prebate greatly lowers the effective tax rate. In fact, typically the FairTax effective tax rate is about half of the effective income tax rate presently

Which has what to do with the price of tea in China? The Fair Tax is designed to be "revenue neutral." The government will be stealing exactly the same amount that they always have. Maybe more.

And "how they steal" IS very important and having the FairTax gives us the visibility for all taxpayers to see how poorly their elected reps are performing with no place for them to hide and finger point (as they now do) to try to escape that responsibility.

How does it do that? There is nothing in this that gives taxation any more or less exposure. The government budget is published every year and the papers splash the totals (3+ trillion for '08) on the front page constantly. If that's not enough evidence for how bad our government has become then nothing will expose it more.

The fact that prices will probably also go down is a big plus also, but mainly improving our exporters businesses would greatly help the economy as should having this country be the largest tax haven from the standpoint of attracting capital for investment (meaning job creation, etc.).

There is no proof that any of this will come to pass. I refuse to pay extra taxes and risk paying even more for speculative nonsense.

All of the same results could be derived from our current tax system if the government just cut spending and that's a certainty.
77 posted on 02/06/2008 7:12:51 AM PST by Filo (Darwin was right!)
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