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To: baybabe
The FairTax bill does, at least, give us some protection from having both since it not only voids the necessary portions of the income tax laws and defunds the IRS but it also requires the destruction of the income tax records.

Which is no protection at all. Although the records may be gone, the laws will still be available. Any congress can reinstate them with a simple hand-vote and a signature from a friendly president.

I could think of any number of "emergencies" they could use to justify it.

Unless the 16th is gone then we will not be at all protected from a dual-tax system.

To reasonably and fairly compare the present tax system and the FairTax the 23% rate is the correct one to use since income tax is tax inclusive.

I'm sorry, but you don't get to be the arbitor of what is reasonable and fair. The Fair Tax is a sales tax and, as such, can only be fairly compared to other sales taxes.

My state sales tax is 8.25% exclusive. The fair tax will be 30%.

Not everything one spends is taxed under the FairTax and that when combined with the prebate greatly lowers the effective tax rate. In fact, typically the FairTax effective tax rate is about half of the effective income tax rate presently

Which has what to do with the price of tea in China? The Fair Tax is designed to be "revenue neutral." The government will be stealing exactly the same amount that they always have. Maybe more.

And "how they steal" IS very important and having the FairTax gives us the visibility for all taxpayers to see how poorly their elected reps are performing with no place for them to hide and finger point (as they now do) to try to escape that responsibility.

How does it do that? There is nothing in this that gives taxation any more or less exposure. The government budget is published every year and the papers splash the totals (3+ trillion for '08) on the front page constantly. If that's not enough evidence for how bad our government has become then nothing will expose it more.

The fact that prices will probably also go down is a big plus also, but mainly improving our exporters businesses would greatly help the economy as should having this country be the largest tax haven from the standpoint of attracting capital for investment (meaning job creation, etc.).

There is no proof that any of this will come to pass. I refuse to pay extra taxes and risk paying even more for speculative nonsense.

All of the same results could be derived from our current tax system if the government just cut spending and that's a certainty.
77 posted on 02/06/2008 7:12:51 AM PST by Filo (Darwin was right!)
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To: Filo
I can just picture the internal memo at the Treasury Dept....

(25%) Bean counters to the SS admin
(25%) Paper Pushers to mediscam admin
(50%) Agents and Managers to the new “BATFE-FT”

78 posted on 02/09/2008 6:28:51 AM PST by xcamel (Two-hand-voting now in play - One on lever, other holding nose.)
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To: Filo
Which is no protection at all.

Actually it's quite a bit of protection while presently under the income tax there is none at all. A sales tax could be voted upon us by congress if they took the notion and one dear Democratic congressman has authored a bill for just that purpose in the last congress. He'll no doubt do it again this session.

So it's your belief that congress can merely "snap its fingers" with the income tax eliminated, the records destroyed and no funding available and - poof - we'd magically have income tax again. Your notion is absurd since if there are enough votes to pass the FairTax (and I believe there will be) there are certainly enough to block any such attempts. After all, that's what we as voters are working to prevent ... well perhaps not you and a few of your ilk.

The FairTax can reasonably only be compared to the tax it replaces - and that's the income tax which is tax inclusive just as the FairTax is. Comparing the two with each on a different tax basis is totally meaningless. I note that none of the attack-bot tribe compare the income tax as tax exclusive with the FairTax as tax inclusive but only by using the misleading differing base for each. Perhaps we should state both as tax exclusive ... yeah, that'd be just fine don't you think???

Your state sales tax percentage is completely irrelevant since most such taxes are rife with exemptions/exclusions thereby raising their rates. Under the FairTax most states will probably opt to conform the the FairTax which would allow the lowering of the state sales tax rates by a very good percentage. The effective FairTax rate will not be "30%" (which is actually 23% to compare it to income tax rates) nor anything like it. It will be something like half the effective tax rate presently under the income tax for most people.

Revenue neutral in the first year and after that the rising economy that results and the benefits to taxpayers along with it will most likely allow the rate to be decreased (unless you and your buddies wish to give the government more money to waste).

If you can't see the obvious flaws in the present tax system that allow congress to boost taxes and give special breaks to special groups or individuals you're certainly more ignorant than you look. With the FairTax there's a single rate, no exceptions and each congressman will be responsible for his up or down vote on it. With the income tax there are endless bills, exceptions, special provisions, etc. going through each session of congress and many opportunities in each for a crafty pol to hide and say "I didn't do that one". With the FairTax it will be plainly obvious to all how high the tax is in each purchase being made at the point of purchase.

You can't see that removing the costs of the income tax system from our exported goods will help us lower prices??? REALLY???!!! Is it your belief it will somehow RAISE prices?

If you genuinely believe that "all of the same results" (you're admitting that there are indeed benefits you see) could be accomplished by tiptoeing through the tax code that we now have, I wonder why it hasn't happened in almost 100 years. At any rate, put your legislation before congress and be sure to post the bill number here so we can all enjoy it.

79 posted on 02/10/2008 11:00:13 AM PST by baybabe
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