Nothing "fair" about the "fair tax"

Leland Tribune ^ | 1/21/2008 | Elaine Mejia

[Daveinyork]

http://libertyunbound.com/archive/2003_04/welber-tax.html

[ejonesie22]

The other psychological issue that will sink the Fair Tax out of the gate is the inequity. The chap bastard down the street who makes his kids wear second hand clothes and such pays no tax while the rest of us have to choose to live like him or be saddled with the burden of supporting our military, veterans and roadways. He gets to enjoy those benefits for free while those of us supporting the economy get stuck with the tab.

It is legalized tax evasion, an the sad thing is, if you read enough of the things said by the FTers it is obvious. Look at the points they stress, keep all your money, “choice” , the prebats etc.

[LibLieSlayer]

Like Rush says... whether you like it or not... a snowball has a better chance in hell than this pipe dream. I cannot envision any Congress doing away with the IRS... aint’ ever going to happen. Some may try... but corruption is deep in DC and America grows dumber, lazier and more socialist... ain’t going to happen in our lifetimes.

LLS

[Misplaced Texan]

The so-called Fair Tax would require an agency double the size of the IRS just to monitor all the zillions of little businesses and products sold all over the country, and the world.

The agencies in the states that currently collect sales tax from "all the zillions of little businessess" would collect the tax.

Would foreign products be taxed? And can we trust foreign governments to fork over 30%.

It will not be necessary to rely on a foreign government to do anything. The sales tax would be on the price of the goods sold from a foreign country.

Do we add another 30% to gasoline? That sounds swell.

The current federal gasoline tax would go away.

Under a fair tax, there would be a huge underground economy within a year.... that would put any current underground economy to shame.

Why do you think that would be the case? The sales tax is on new goods of which most are sold through normal sales channels.

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Would you rather maintain the yoke of slavery that the current income tax instills upon us all?

[RangerM]

... whether you like it or not... a snowball has a better chance in hell than this pipe dream.

Kinda' reminds me of Fred Thompson's Presidential hopes.

[Turret Gunner A20]

HAHAHAHAHA!

[Man50D]

The so-called Fair Tax would require an agency double the size of the IRS just to monitor all the zillions of little businesses and products sold all over the country, and the world.

Wrong. The size of government will be noticeably reduced since the 140 million individual tax filers will be reduced to 20 million businesses filers.

Would foreign products be taxed? And can we trust foreign governments to fork over 30%.

Imported products will pay The fair Tax but exported products will not have to pay. That will eliminate the 17% competitive advantage for foreign products. Fair Tax FAQ #31

Do we add another 30% to gasoline? That sounds swell.

Do you make it a point to be obtuse about The Fair Tax or is it just a bad habit?

Under a fair tax, there would be a huge underground economy within a year.... that would put any current underground economy to shame.

It will be much tougher for people to evade the Fair tax as they will have to buy an overwhelming of their purchases over the counter. The reduction of the number of filers stated above will make it easier to spot those who do evade tax payment. The income tax requires only one to cheat the system. The Fair Tax will require at least two cheaters, The business owner and the consumer. People will have much less incentive to cheat when they see more money in their paychecks and don't have to file anymore tax forms.

[CitizenUSA]

Turrent Gunner A20: “I don’t know about you, but I think that stinks.”

I never said I like taxes. I only wonder what impact an overt tax like the Fair Tax would have on the economy. It’s something that should be at least considered, since our economy is presently very dependent on consumption.

As for the crooks who keep taking more, well...we let them. Americans could rise up whenever they wanted to kick the shysters out, but I can only conclude majorities like the government we keep getting (unfortunately).

[A Balrog of Morgoth]

The current federal gasoline tax would go away.

No, it won't. The environmentalist whackos will make sure of that.

Not really germane to the discussion at hand. Just a point I believe worthy of note.

[RangerM]

“The current federal gasoline tax would go away.”

You other points are valid, except that one.

Remember, the FairTax is not about money; it’s about power and influence.

Who has it (the politicians), who wants to wield it (the lobbyists), and who wants to take it back (We the People...)

[Steamburg]

As in the devil we know vs. the oily devil we haven’t met, yet. One real answer is to reduce the government by 30% the first year and 10% each year following and to use fair tax calculation in the cuts. Soon we would reach a point at which government was palatable and met its Constitutional roll.

I’m afraid that all of this is wishing as long as Tocqueville’s rule remains, (paraphrased) “The republic is safe until politicians learn that they can bribe you with your own money.”

[sergeantdave]

“This brings me to the third myth – that a 30% rate would be adequate to run the federal government.”

This socialist reveals herself. What she’s really worried about is that the pig bureaucrats and thieving politicians won’t have enough money to run the criminal fascist syndicate occupying Washington.

Whenever the current Marxist applecart tax system is threatened, the socialists and others who leech off the system come out screaming.

My solution to cut taxes and business costs is simple - fire every fascist/Marxist federal bureaucrat who’s not involved in national security.

[raybbr]

This article loses all credibility with this statement. Fair Tax opposer's are deliberately leaving out one very important fact. The Fair Tax ill eliminate the hidden/embedded 23% Corporate income taxes and associated compliance costs known as the inclusive rate. The $100 item will then cost $77 and the $23(100*.23) will be the tax rate applied externally to the $77 as the tax exclusive rate of 30%. Consequently the price will remain at $100.

Don't fair-taxers leave out the fact that everything a corporation buys would be taxed at the mythical 23%? Wouldn't that cost be embedded in the price of everything all over again?

[raybbr]

Who has it (the politicians), who wants to wield it (the lobbyists), and who wants to take it back (We the People...)

Since "we the people" don'ts set the rate how would "we" be in control?

[Wolfie]

Socialist my ass. She’s a realist. The Federal Gov’t doesn’t go without. It either raises taxes or deficit spends. And you seem to have forgotten that the Fair Tax mantra is supposed to include the term “revenue neutral”.

[RangerM]

“The republic is safe until politicians learn that they can bribe you with your own money.”

I’d say a significant portion of our countrymen have enthusiastically chosen to enslave themselves to the government.

“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until a majority of voters discover that they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury.”
- Alexander Tytler

Thanks to the democrats and their followers, we are well on our way there. Once the electoral college is abolished (happening right now), mob rule shall prevail.

Those on public assistance should lose their right to vote.

[Man50D]

FLAT TAX people. It’s the only truly FAIR tax.

The Fair Tax is a flat tax, on consumption. A flat tax on income you favor has been tried and is failing. It's called the income tax. When enacted in 1913 it taxed 1% of the first $20,000 and 7% over $500,000. So few people earned more than $500,000 that they essentially paid the former rate. In 1913 less than 5% of the population was taxed. Today more than 80% of the population pays an income tax. Another flat tax on income is only reinventing the wheel and will eventually create another oppressive, complex tax code only the cycle will happen much quicker thanks to thousands of lobbyists that didn't exist in 1913.

[Wolfie]

Just don’t buy anything. Of course, in a popcorn fart economy based on consumer spending, that might not be such a good thing.

[RangerM]

It is much more difficult to play “class warfare” with a flat rate, especially when income is unknown.

Any alteration in the tax rate hurts all equally; rich and poor alike. No more demagoguery of the “evil rich”

[CitizenUSA]

Man50D: “I suggest you actually read the bill and visit the AFFT website before making anymore erroneous statements.”

Nothing erroneous about wondering about the impact of a consumption tax on a consumption-based economy. As I wrote, Fair Tax advocates write as though it’s all about numbers. It’s anyone’s guess what the tax would actually do. I suppose someone could analyze Europe’s VAT for clues, but who can predict? Plus, I think Fair Tax fans are extremely naive to think politicians will give up the source of their power. Even if I liked it, and some parts I do, it’s just not going to happen.