Posted on 12/17/2007 9:05:27 AM PST by Balata
“Boyd told KRDO that Bourbonnais should have evacuated the building with the rest of the parishioners.”
It’s important to be a sheep and follow the flock.
Unless there is more to this story than we are being told, the leadership at that church are idiots.
Im sure there is much more to the story. Church leadership does not make these sort of decision without going through biblical reasoning, he must have provoked them.
““His actions last weekend probably did more to harm the process than to help it,” Boyd told KRDO.”
Gosh, I thought he was one of the hero’s who saved at least 100 other church members.
This article was on the front page of the Colorado Springs Gazette today with a picture of a uniformed police officer escorting Larry Bourbonnais off the church grounds.
It don’t figure.
The guy has been on several local news outlets and has basically “bragged” he had tried to stop the kid and got shot in the arm.
It’s possible he did just that in an attempt to help. I’m not sure about the remarks that he repeatedly asked one of the guards to give up his weapon though, that sounds a bit odd, and I’m sure as hell not handing a weapon over to someone else no matter who he is, and especially not when he’s begging for it.
That’s what sounds “off” in this story to me.
Is this the so-called "process" of healing? In that case, sweeping the facts under the rug helps nobody. The correct response to the other guards' non-response is to find some new guards, not punish the whistle blower. Those that are traumatized by the shooting and still refuse to take measures to defend themselves will probably take comfort in knowing they're no longer guarded by sheep.
Ladies and gentlemen of Freerepublic.com, your protection is up to you. Leadership will not and can not protect you. Get your concealed carry permit and bear arms everywhere that it is legal to do so.
Ping...
Monday morning quarterbacking. What do ya think?
There is a tremendous trait among humans to try to find meaning or significance in events. The fact is many events (maybe most) have no deeper meaning or significance. Sometimes bad things just happen.
This tendency is common with both religious folks and non-religious folks. There seems to be a remarkable reluctance to cope with the fact that some things in life are just up to chance.
Larry Bourbonnais, 59, left church grounds peacefully at the request of church officials, who called in Colorado Springs police for extra support.
“He cooperated, and we told him that he wasn’t welcome back on the property,” police Sgt. Lonnie Spanswick said.
Church officials told police they plan to file a restraining order against Bourbonnais, Spanswick said.”
What provocation would evoke this response? Would critisizing the armed guard that did nothing be reason enough?
If he did in fact plead with one of the guards to give him a gun so he could help, he should be applauded for that too, and the security guards should be better trained to act when confronted by such a killer as Murray..but all of that is where the story is not as clear I am sure.
If Bourbonnais went about bragging about his own actions and publically down talking the security guards as opposed to working with them...then that not only throws doubt (IMHO) on his own strory, such actions would certainly unavoidably lead to a disagreement and break with the church and its leadership.
Whatever the case, if Bourbonnais distracted the gunman at risk to his own life just before Jeanne shot the gunman, then Bourbonnais deserves praise for that act of bravery and should not be labeled as someone who should have run the other way. As I say, if that is in fact what he did (confront the killer) then his actions added materially to the outcome IMHO.
Jeff, thanks for your reply. I always look forward to your input. The following link has an interesting discussion on this topic. One of the posters claims to be Larry’s son-in-law. He stated the church hasn’t contacted Larry to thank him or recognize him in anyway since the shooting. There is also a response by a church member.
http://www.gazette.com/articles/church_30970___article.html/boyd_sunday.html
“I’m sure as hell not handing a weapon over to someone else no matter who he is, and especially not when he’s begging for it.”
You probably aren’t one to stand around when action is needed and people are getting shot either.
Larry Bourbonnais, 59, left church grounds peacefully at the request of church officials, who called in Colorado Springs police for extra support.
“He cooperated, and we told him that he wasn’t welcome back on the property,” police Sgt. Lonnie Spanswick said.
Church officials told police they plan to file a restraining order against Bourbonnais, Spanswick said.
In a news conference after church, Boyd said of Bourbonnais, “We felt he was a bit volatile this morning, and we did not want any disruption to our service.” Boyd said officials will be reaching out to Bourbonnais this week to ensure an “amicable” resolution. Boyd didn’t elaborate.
Does anyone else find this more than a little strange? why would Bourbonnais want to talk to them after how they treated him?
Larry was also accosted by a Deacon of the Church on Monday night according to his son-in-law
LOL! Reaching out with a restraining order.
I am larry's son-in-law. I have been there through all of this and I as a person and a member of the family am outraged with the way NLC handled this. Instead of calling him him at some point in time throughout the week and saying "Hey Larry can you sit this one out" they did nothing until Sunday moring. How do I know this you ask per his request I had the mans phone the whole entire week. I have feilded calls from the media, his friends and family. Oddly enough I go through my notes and nothing from new life. I destincly remember make several calls to new life so Larry could talk to someone in the leadership. Not once did any of our messages get returned.I know it is their side, so I am interested in hearing what the Church has to say...but I have to say, what Tobias relates sure sounds bad for the church. Unless there is something more (and there could be), along the lines of what I posted in my last response, it sure stinks to high heaven what they are doing to this man.
Monday night he went to the church and was acosted by a deacon. The deacon said "At this time of hightened security we would appriciate it if you didn't say anything bad about the security staff." which larry refused to lie about what happed. The deacon then grabbed larry's left arm (the one he got shot in) and prceeded to yell at him. That was the last contact larry had with church until sunday morning.
Larry is a good christian and as a good christian he attends not only the services but sunday school before hand. He showed up early, as he does every Sunday, and spoke to his friends and went through the whole entire class with no interuption. At the end he walked to the sanctuary to attend the services. Before the man even had an oppertunity to sit down 13 men including 2 members of the colorado springs police department(there only by the reqeust of the leadership)man handled him out of the building.
I ask you do think that it should take 13 men to escort a calm 59 year old man outside? my answer.. absolutely not. Particularly a 59 year old man who had been shot a weeek before. As for the theory of larry being not asked to come. It's kinda hard to ask someone not to come if you don't talk to them. in fact if asked not to come he wouldn't have. We could have gone to another church. Since we felt part of the healing proccess was going back to the place where everything happened, we went to church. At this point we are 98% sure that the church's reasoning was because they din't want larry to belittle the security that day. Which at no point in time has he ever doneand will he ever do. In all of the interveiws he gave not once did he he say anything negative to/about the 2 security gaurds. Mearly that he was unarmed and they weren't shooting so he thought of something else that help distract him long enough for Ms. Assam to do what she did. I also revert to the interviews adn in every single one he praised Jeanne for being brave and doing what she did.
The point is that why would you kick a hero out of church. Better yet why would you kick a christian out of church? As of right now we may never find out. Pastor Brady Boyd says he's been trying to call but no calls have come through. Will this be the same of trying to come to an amicable resolution? We will just have to wait and see.
The family only means to display its disgust for the church and the way they handled things. At no point in time do we want CSPD to catch any flack about this. They were mearly doing as the land owner asked for which we thank them for doing their jobs.
The leadership of the Church doesn’t seem to be passing this “Test”, or at least the PR part of it.
Perhaps, and this is the only reason I can think of, they don’t want future potential shooters, God forbid, to think their security guards won’t act in times of crisis.
Maybe we’ll hear from Jeanne soon.
While I can certainly understand your point about Bourbonnais being treated in a less-than-Christian manner, it is also easy to see that this highly emotional event has supercharged the atmosphere for the leadership. Personally, I must admit I am biased and have a hard time being as gracious as I should when I read the less-than-literate perspective presented by Tobias. Add in Bourbonnais' imprudent actions (riding to the sound of guns when he didn't have one, breaking the First Rule of a Gunfight: bring a gun) and words (criticizing those who followed the rules) and the family begins to appear a few fries short of a Happy Meal, IMO. I have a suspicion that Bourbonnais has posed other challenges for church leadership and this put him over the line of their tolerance level.
One person may call that imprudent...another, when you take into account that people were being killed and the guy was intent on killing more, and this man apparently is a Vietnam combat vet, could also call it couragous to try and stop a mad killer who has an asault rifle and handgun and beaucuop ammo, by taking him on without one.
At the very least his distraction would allow time for others to escape...or, as it turned out, someone with a gun to get into position to take the killer down.
My jury is still out too...but I tend towards the latter category. When a guy with a gun is attacking women, children, and men who are crowded into a large sanctuary...and the killer is headed that way...IMHO, a couragous person tries to stop them with whatever he can muster.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.