Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Jerseyan recalls living hell on ship, USS Forrestal
star ledger ^ | July 29, 2007 | GABRIEL H. GLUCK

Posted on 08/26/2007 1:44:09 PM PDT by Coleus

It was 40 years ago today, in the waters off Vietnam, that the crew of the USS Forrestal saw the gates of hell. A missile accidentally fired from a plane on the flight deck triggered a blazing inferno that would claim the lives of 134 men, two from New Jersey -- Francis Campeau of Bergenfield and Richard Vallone of Bridgewater. Not since World War II had a ship's crew sustained so many casualties.

The Forrestal, the first of the Navy's newest class of super carriers left Norfolk, Va., in June 1967 for what was to be her first combat deployment. Arriving off the coast of Vietnam on July 25, combat operations went into full swing, with the Forrestal's aircraft flying 150 sorties over the next four days.

The Tonkin Gulf was exceptionally hot and the morning of July 29 was no different. Walter Stinner woke at 4:30 a.m., along with the rest of his crew, to prepare the planes for the day's missions, Stinner grew up in Elizabeth's port section. Five days after he graduated high school in June, 1967, he enlisted in the Navy. With the war in Vietnam escalating, he figured he'd rather choose the branch of service he would serve in, than have it chosen for him.

Crews were prepping planes for the second launch of the morning, when shortly before 11 a.m., a Zuni rocket accidentally fired from an F-4 Phantom. It flew across the deck, striking a 400-gallon fuel tank on a parked A-4D Skyhawk -- a plane that was to be flown by Sen. John McCain, then a young pilot.

(Excerpt) Read more at nj.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; US: New Jersey
KEYWORDS: aircraftcarriers; militaryhistory; navair; navalaviation; norfolk; usnavy; ussforrestal; vietnam
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-68 next last
To: Diana in Wisconsin

I used to be on the USS JFK, and while I never really thought about it much, I had never considered much the implications of being in a shooting war.

One night on the ship, I had this dream. I dreamt I was in a lifejacket, treading water astern of the sinking ship, when the stern settled, and the bow began to come out of the water. It went up, up, up against the black sky lit by the stars, and I could see the black shape of the flight deck hundreds of feet above me as it blotted out the stars.

Slowly, it began to fall...directly down on me. 85,000 tons of ship began to come down right on top of me. Then I woke up. That was a pretty scary nightmare.

I once met a guy who was the ship’s doctor aboard the USS Indianapolis. I spent several hours with him... I shudder to think what kind of nightmares he had.


41 posted on 08/26/2007 8:22:01 PM PDT by rlmorel (Liberals: If the Truth would help them, they would use it.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: Bigg Red
Wow! God bless our brave fighting men — past and present.

Note: These were Boomer generation.

42 posted on 08/26/2007 8:46:48 PM PDT by sionnsar (trad-anglican.faithweb.com |Iran Azadi| 5yst3m 0wn3d - it's N0t Y0ur5 (SONY) | UN: Useless Nations)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: SAMWolf; snippy_about_it
The FReeper Foxhole Remembers the USS Forrestal Fire (7/29/1967) - Oct 14th, 2003

43 posted on 08/26/2007 9:47:48 PM PDT by Coleus (Pro Deo et Patria)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: tgslTakoma

A shipboard fire is a real bear - there’s nowhere to run. Fight or die.


44 posted on 08/27/2007 2:25:16 AM PDT by R. Scott (Humanity i love you because when you're hard up you pawn your Intelligence to buy a drink)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Bean Counter
The US Navy Firefughting Schools have been using film of the Forrestal fire for decades, to show how not to fight a major conflagration like that.

It had it's lessons that's for sure. The men on that ship were hero's though. One good thing came from the three tragedies {carrier fires in that era} was the development of the Hi-Cap system. They put them on the flight deck and hanger deck. HI-Caps when activate automatically layed down AFFF Aqueous Film Forming Foam. The later version of it mid 1970's era I think was an improvement also.

The AFFF helped cut down on re-flash. IIRC from the film the main mistake on Forestall involved mis-communication about the foam. They also put a Fire Truck on carriers and the Crash and Salvage crews got fire suits. The only draw back on Hi-Caps was the manual refill. 5 gallon buckets took a while to fill the tank back up and a lot of manpower to get them to the station.

Somebody told me a while back the Navy now uses a version of Scott Air packs. A huge improvement too IMO. The old Chemical OBA's had a bad tendency to konk out and you had to really regulate your breathing. Not an easy task when you run the length of the ship and up several decks then strap one on. The OBA's cannisters were dangerous to dispose of also. One drop of contaminated water and BOOM!

I never knew many who were on Fire Department though who didn't like the job. The Navy changed to a full time onboard Fire Departments on carriers in 1980 or 81. Before that mainly the Snipes from R-Divison handled it at sea and in the yards they set up a temporary fire department on the ship from all departments. I did over 9 months T.A.D. to it.

45 posted on 08/27/2007 2:54:07 AM PDT by cva66snipe (Proud Partisan Constitution Supporting Conservative to which I make no apologies for nor back down)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: magslinger

Please add me to the Navair ping list. Thanks!


46 posted on 08/27/2007 3:02:00 AM PDT by Blue Eyes (Praying for a miracle.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: IncPen; BartMan1

ping


47 posted on 08/27/2007 3:17:14 AM PDT by Nailbiter
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]

To: Coleus; All
With great pleasure I drop by to reminisce with Navy fighting men, men with the full knowledge of Duty, Honor, Country. Was one myself in 1965-69.

The best men of my generation went to Viet Nam if they were asked. The rest do not count.

Do recollect fire fighting training in the big simulators at Norfolk. My mother’s older brother served aboard the old Enterprise from 1939 to 1943, Santa Cruz, Solomon Islands, kamikaze, was flight deck damage control CPO in ‘43, saw many, many flight and hanger deck emergencies. He said that the Franklin took damage rather routine by Enterprise standards (!!!!) but couldn’t control the fire. Whew, I recollect the training films about Franklin.

48 posted on 08/27/2007 5:12:11 AM PDT by Iris7 ("Do not live lies!" ...Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: neodad
The Navy made a documentary of the fire. Required viewing at Damage Control School and Surface Warfare Officer’s School. Hell on Earth is correct.

I remember watching it during basic and several other times during my Navy career. I think that everyone in the Navy called the ship the "USS Forrest Fire"

49 posted on 08/27/2007 10:36:08 AM PDT by P8riot (I carry a gun because I can't carry a cop.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: shorty_harris

same here too.... a very sobering movie...meet a guy who was on that ship.. He had been in the navy all of about 6 months at the time...


50 posted on 08/27/2007 10:40:44 AM PDT by FlatLandBeer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: Iris7
Do recollect fire fighting training in the big simulators at Norfolk

It wasn't nothing fancy or at least in the late 70's anyway. It was just above the D&S piers maybe a half mile. The training structure wasn't that big about like what was used in the civilian world. IIRC it was one story I think two at the most but I don't remember stairs though. They would send us into it in different conditions including without an OBA so we could know how to survive off the hose if we had to. That trick got me out of a bad place one night. I was one on one and my OBA collapsed.

The most impressive lesson besides Forestall in Fire Fighting School was the grease fire demonstration. They had a pit that they set on fire and the instructor had a pole about 20 feet long with a cup of water on the end of it. A demonstration that showed why you do not use water on a grease fire was given.

When we were in the yards we sometimes got to train at the Yardbirds facility too. I think it was laid out more like a house though. I think I was involved in AMERICA first bad fire of any size. It was in a storeroom aft on the Hanger Bay. Another A-gang guy and myself were T.A.D. to Fire Department and discovered it. It had been going for a while. The heat transfer went up on the 02 level. No one got hurt but it took a while to put it out. The Barber Shop on the 02 level was destroyed due to water damage the 02 level also had a JP-5 day tank we were very concerned about and kept it cooled. The Barber shop deck was so hot I saw the floor tiles buckling.

51 posted on 08/27/2007 12:34:51 PM PDT by cva66snipe (Proud Partisan Constitution Supporting Conservative to which I make no apologies for nor back down)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 48 | View Replies]

To: rlmorel

My wife has COPD (breathing problem) and carries a neat little flask of LOX slung over her shoulder whenever we go out. Also from time to time we drive around with a tank of about 50 pounds of the stuff in the back of our pickup. No HAZMAT placards of any kind anywhere. This system is far more convenient for the patient than having to use the old heavy tanks, but for someone aware of what LOX can do it does seem a bit scary, especially out in freeway traffic. Just yesterday afternoon I saw some upscale import, Lexus or the like, completely destroyed up to the rear axle, with two fire trucks standing by. Glad it wasn’t our truck.


52 posted on 08/27/2007 1:38:15 PM PDT by 19th LA Inf
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies]

To: R. Scott

My father was on the Constellation for, I think, two fires. He didn’t like to talk about it much.


53 posted on 08/27/2007 1:45:01 PM PDT by swain_forkbeard (Rationality may not be sufficient, but it is necessary.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: sionnsar

...Boomer generation

>>

Yes, I know. And, as a boomer, I remember this incident, but I do nor recall seeing such a detailed description of it when it occurred.


54 posted on 08/27/2007 1:57:43 PM PDT by Bigg Red (Duncan Hunter in 2008!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: cva66snipe

You have more fire fighting experience than I. Never had to deal with anything uncontrolled.

It has been some time, but if I recollect at Norfolk there was a two story concrete structure with a little bitty stairway entrance room on the roof. This was used for OBA demonstration. The fires in the simulator were minor, you could see a battle lantern held up to your facepiece. I suppose they were looking for claustrophobia freak outs. Could easily have somebody stuck in there if the fire was too intense.

The hot fires were run in a single story structure (maybe two) with the fires let run longer and longer as the two day school went on. I recall running a lot with charged 2 1/2” hoses. That nozzle work is team work, for a fact.

Only had my last 16 months aboard ship, the rest of my time was “brown water” or mud, mostly. Certainly rear echelon enough, here I am.

Looking back I think that those Fleet guys thought I was a bit crazy. Mostly I was just tired.


55 posted on 08/27/2007 2:12:19 PM PDT by Iris7 ("Do not live lies!" ...Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 51 | View Replies]

To: Iris7
It sounds like the same place to me. Nothing real fancy just functional enough to suit the purpose. There was a class room also IIRC. I first went there in 1978 I think then a number of times afterward. That whole area outside the main gate did some radical changes. Some guys told me a year before outside the main gate there were diners, bars, etc within walking distance. When I got to the ship if you wanted a meal off ship close the base was the only place. From there the next place was Denny's in Oceanview up from the Greyhound depot. The amusement was torn down on my 77 MED Cruise.

I went back to Norfolk a few years ago and Oceanview as it once stood was gone even the apartments up on the curve. It looked like somebody had ran a dozer from one end to the other. I found my old apartment the only one still standing across from where Best Western was.

Outside the Main Gate on the pier side of the base was several miles of fast food and businesses. I managed to drive by memory the roads from the main gate towards town across to Military Hi-way, to Little Creek Road and to Oceanview. I used to walk it LOL. Heck me and some friends used to walk to the mall on Military Hi-way from the ship.

A bit Crazy was a good way to survive it all. I was one of the crazies myself. I used to growl and bark at my First Class LOL. He was crazier than I was but one great man to work for.

56 posted on 08/27/2007 2:40:53 PM PDT by cva66snipe (Proud Partisan Constitution Supporting Conservative to which I make no apologies for nor back down)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 55 | View Replies]

To: Brucifer

Oxygen Breathing Apparatus, it allows you to re breathe your own air. This is done with a canister that oxygen is generated as you breathe through it.


57 posted on 08/27/2007 2:45:46 PM PDT by U S Army EOD (Say Cheese.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: Brucifer
What is an OBA?


58 posted on 08/27/2007 2:46:11 PM PDT by Polybius
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: Bigg Red

“Believe it or not, my older sister thought, until it came up in a conversation a few years back, the the expression was “keyhole” rather than “keel-haul”.”

Funny how people hear different things. Until a couple of years ago my teenage son thought “going to Hell in a hand basket” was “Going to Hell in a ham basket”. Said he thought it was a Jewish expression.


59 posted on 08/27/2007 2:48:25 PM PDT by Rb ver. 2.0 (Reunite Gondwanaland!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: Coleus; All

And then there was the USS Ben Franklin, a most incredible story of “A Ship That Wouldn’t Die”.


60 posted on 08/27/2007 2:50:56 PM PDT by U S Army EOD (Say Cheese.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-68 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson