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Fair Tax, Foul Politics [NRO on FairTax]
Fair Tax, Foul Politics ^ | August 16, 2007 | NRO Editors

Posted on 08/16/2007 6:10:39 PM PDT by RobFromGa

Fair Tax, Foul Politics

By The Editors

Advocates of a national sales tax to replace the income tax have built an impressive grassroots army. They have given their idea an appealing, if somewhat gimmicky, name: the Fair Tax. And they have managed to get five Republican presidential candidates to suggest that they would sign a sales-tax bill if it reached their desk. Some observers credit the enthusiasm of the Fair Taxers for Gov. Mike Huckabee’s surprisingly strong showing in the Iowa straw poll. Huckabee is the candidate most committed to the Fair Tax.

Former senator Fred Thompson is, however, backing away from the idea. Fair Tax advocates have released a video in which Thompson, asked about the proposal, appears to say he would “absolutely” sign it if elected. On August 10, however, Thompson wrote those advocates a letter that said merely that the Fair Tax was a good starting point in thinking about tax reform. Mitt Romney’s campaign says that the Fair Tax has some attractive elements, but that the candidate would need to see details before making any pledges. Rudolph Giuliani has said that he does not think he would sign any such legislation.

The leading candidates are right to be wary. The tax code needs major reform to become fairer, simpler, and more efficient. The Fair Tax is one instantiation of those goals, but its political impracticality makes it fatally flawed. If conservatives force a choice between a Fair Tax and no tax reform at all, the latter is what they are likely to get.

There is widespread confusion about what the Fair Tax would entail. If you bought $100 of clothing and paid a $30 tax on it, you would probably think you had paid a 30 percent tax. The Fair Taxers say that you paid a 23 percent tax: $30 is 23 percent of the $130 you paid in total. When they say they want a 23 percent tax, that’s what they mean.

Since there would be no more income tax in this system, there would also be no more standard exemption to make sure that the basic necessities of life went untaxed. The Fair Taxers would solve this problem by sending out monthly “prebate” checks to all Americans.

The great, undeniably attractive selling point of the Fair Tax is that it would allow the country to dispense with the IRS. But the sad truth is that if the federal government is going to collect as much money as it currently does—which the Fair Taxers say their system would—its methods of tax collection will inevitably be intrusive. The real difference between the current system and this proposal is that the primary brunt of tax collection will be borne by a smaller group of people: business owners.

Over time, then, enforcement measures could become more draconian than they are today: especially since a massive retail sales tax would create a massive incentive to evade it. That’s why every country that has ever tried to impose retail sales taxes this high has quickly moved to a Value Added Tax levied at every stage of production. Consumers rarely see or keep track of these taxes, and they seem to be fairly easy for governments to raise.

These pitfalls are beside the point, however, since a national sales tax is not going to become law. No presidential candidate could be elected on a sales-tax platform, and no Congress would enact one if he were.

A candidate who ran on the national sales tax would be able to run on nothing else. He would have to spend all of his time defending the idea. Off the top of our heads, we can think of three devastating lines of attack an opponent could use in television ads. One ad could argue that getting rid of the mortgage deduction would send home prices into free fall (something that voters are going to find especially worrisome now). Another could ask why senior citizens, having paid taxes all their lives as they made income, should have to spend their retirements paying taxes on everything they use that money to buy. A third could simply ask voters if they look forward to paying a brand new tax.

There are answers to each attack. But no Republican candidate, especially in the daunting environment of 2008, is going to want to have to make them. Republicans cannot win a national election without the tax issue. If they ran on the national sales tax, Republicans would be taking one of their natural strengths and making it into a liability. Which is why we expect them to say nice things about the Fair Taxers’ passion, and move on.


TOPICS: Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: fairtax; fraudulent; freelunch
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To: Bigun

just as I suspected...

chirp chirp chirp...


41 posted on 08/16/2007 6:51:36 PM PDT by xcamel ("It's Talk Thompson Time!" >> irc://irc.freenode.net/fredthompson)
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To: Your Nightmare
Do you have any idea what the Flat Tax is?

If you are referring to the flat income tax then yes I do but I SERIOUSLY doubt that YOU do.

42 posted on 08/16/2007 6:51:48 PM PDT by Bigun (IRS sucks @getridof it.com)
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To: Bigun

in europe we are seeing tax competition. They are lowering the rates because they want more economic growth.

Consumption taxes will either not be lowered or even raised -especially on the ‘bad’ things like gas, cigarettes, alcohol. There will be all kinds of exceptions: things that poor people buy, which get a lower rate, and things rich people usually buy, which get a higher rate. And most of these changes will be hidden as opposed to a single bill that tells you exactly what you have to pay in taxes.


43 posted on 08/16/2007 6:51:54 PM PDT by ari-freedom (I am for traditional moral values, a strong national defense, and free markets.)
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To: bahblahbah
There are crane operators out there who know that if you buy $100 worth of clothes the 23% FairTax comes out of the $100. Nothing is added to the price.
What happened to "the Fairtax is more visible"? "Everyone will know the true cost of government"? And other such nonsense. And now you're saying the Fairtax is a hidden tax.

Also, what does MR. Superior have against crane operators?

44 posted on 08/16/2007 6:52:54 PM PDT by lewislynn (What does the global warming movement and the Fairtax movement have in common? Disinformation)
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To: Bigun

Politicians will always be politicians. The FairTax would not change this even though it’s cheerleaders assert that it would. The prebate would be one obvious area to manipulate one group against another. There are many other ways to play the game, with the income surtax on the “rich” being one of the most obvious, especially after the disaster of the FairTax unfolded. We would end up with both a sales tax and an income tax just like most of Europe...


45 posted on 08/16/2007 6:54:35 PM PDT by RobFromGa (FDT/TBD in 2008!)
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To: RobFromGa
It is really quite simple

Replace politicians that won't sign on to the fair tax

We the supporters are growing by leaps and bounds that has a whole lot of people worried such as politicians that won't sign on to the fair tax

Vote for those on board = Fair Tax

46 posted on 08/16/2007 6:55:12 PM PDT by Sounder
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To: RobFromGa
Politicians will always be politicians. The FairTax would not change this even though it’s cheerleaders assert that it would.

Yep! But they would find it several orders of magnitude harder to do with the Fairtax what they are currently doing with ease under the income tax.

I prefer FREEDOM thank you!

47 posted on 08/16/2007 6:58:58 PM PDT by Bigun (IRS sucks @getridof it.com)
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To: Sounder
like the .0000007% of the population that supports the FT is really causing any candidates to shake in their boots... sheesh.
48 posted on 08/16/2007 6:59:31 PM PDT by xcamel ("It's Talk Thompson Time!" >> irc://irc.freenode.net/fredthompson)
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To: Bigun

you asked for it :)
The Fair Tax Fraud
http://www.mises.org/story/1814


49 posted on 08/16/2007 6:59:50 PM PDT by ari-freedom (I am for traditional moral values, a strong national defense, and free markets.)
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To: Bigun

Try moving to Muldova.. thet have exactly what you want...


50 posted on 08/16/2007 7:00:33 PM PDT by xcamel ("It's Talk Thompson Time!" >> irc://irc.freenode.net/fredthompson)
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To: lewislynn
Isn't it amazing that #6 comes from Neal Boortz? He who clarified this whole thing back in August 2005 and now he is back to promising the Free Lunch...Remember this from Boortz?

"This brings us to the question of embedded taxes in the cost of consumer goods and services, and your paychecks.

As explained in The FairTax Book, there are taxes embedded in everything we buy. Every entity which provides a product or service in the design, production, marketing, distribution and sale of every consumer good or service will incur some tax liability as they perform their particular function. This tax liability will be incorporated into whatever these individuals or business entitles charge for their services, and will all passed through to become a part of the final cost of the product or service.

Now here's what we didn't explain well in the book.

Every employee of any company involved in American commerce is also a provider of a service, and, as such, the employee incurs a tax liability as a result of his or her work. This tax liability is incorporated into what the employee charges the employer for their services, and is eventually incorporated into the final retail cost of the employer's product or service. Each employee is essentially a separate business entity providing a product, be it physical or mental labor, to the employer.

The extensive research behind HR 25, The FairTax Bill, shows that the average embedded taxes in every consumer product or service is about 22%. In some industries, such as leather goods, the embedded tax is smaller. In other industries, such as homebuilding and construction, the embedded tax is higher, but it averages out to somewhere between 22 and 23%. With the passage of The FairTax Bill, those embedded taxes disappear. These embedded taxes include the combined tax burdens of all entities involved in bringing those goods or services to market, and that includes you, the employee, and the taxes you incur as a result of your employment.

We write in The FairTax Book that the competitive pressures of the marketplace will force prices down when embedded taxes disappear from the cost of retail goods and services, and we cite 22% as the average amount of those embedded taxes. Does this 22% include the income and payroll taxes that are paid by employees? Yes, it does. So ... what does this mean to your paycheck after the FairTax becomes law?

When the FairTax is implemented, and when business and personal income and payroll taxes disappear, your employer is going to have to make a decision. He will either take some or the entire amount he had been withholding for federal income and payroll taxes and add it to your weekly check, or he will readjust your pay figures so that your entire paycheck will be equal to what you used to call "take home pay" before the FairTax. The employer may also decide to do a little of both. Either way, you can see that the amount of money you actually receive as pay – the amount you can put into your bank account – will not decrease, and may actually increase.

On a larger scale real wages will rise to the extent to which the nation's employers decide to return the embedded costs of their employee's income and payroll taxes to the employee. Likewise, the cost of the products or services produced by the employer will be reduced to the extent to which that employer retains all or a portion of those income and payroll taxes together with the other taxes on capital and labor eliminated by the FairTax. Once again, a zero-sum, revenue neutral game.

Now, let's elaborate on the "keep 100% of your paycheck" line that appears in The FairTax Book. It is certainly true that after the FairTax becomes law there will be no more withholding from your paycheck for any federal taxes. What you earn is what you get. This is not to say that your gross pay will equal what it was before the FairTax. This will depend on what your employer does when the embedded costs represented by the tax burden you have passed on to your employer disappear. One thing is certain: You will suffer no decrease in real or net earnings --- the amount of each paycheck you deposit into your bank account every other week. The "keep 100% of your paycheck" concept can more easily be applied to those who either change jobs or come into the labor force after the implementation of the FairTax. A new worker will negotiate a wage with an employer knowing that the amount negotiated will be the amount that worker receives every two weeks ... no deductions. Likewise, when you change employers you, too, will negotiate a wage that will not be subject to withholding, and you will get 100% of your wages in each paycheck."

Neal Boortz: Straightening Out some confusion

51 posted on 08/16/2007 7:01:57 PM PDT by RobFromGa (FDT/TBD in 2008!)
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To: RobFromGa
The NRO doesn't mention just what the income tax does. If you like an intrusive system, you'll love the IRS. Under a Fair Tax, every one pays ONCE when they're taxed. Now they're taxed multiple times and we owe half of our income to the government. All the Fair Tax would do is return us to the tax system we had before the 16th Amendment was passed. But there's more to be gained in class warfare than from a truly rational tax system - and politicians don't want to give up the power of setting preferred social goals through manipulation of a complex income tax code.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

52 posted on 08/16/2007 7:02:25 PM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: ari-freedom
This is good too... The Fraudulent Tax
53 posted on 08/16/2007 7:04:01 PM PDT by RobFromGa (FDT/TBD in 2008!)
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To: ari-freedom
I have, long ago, read Mr. Vance's article and simply disagree with his conclusions.

Do you REALLY want to defend the current income tax system?

54 posted on 08/16/2007 7:04:21 PM PDT by Bigun (IRS sucks @getridof it.com)
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To: Sounder

The Fair Tax is a fraud, any politician that supports it is either not intelligent, or hasn’t read the bill, or knows nothing about running a business. Or all three.

Support for the FairTax is a good reason to withdraw support from a politician.


55 posted on 08/16/2007 7:05:56 PM PDT by RobFromGa (FDT/TBD in 2008!)
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To: goldstategop
All the Fair Tax would do is return us to the tax system we had before the 16th Amendment was passed.

Complete poppycock.

56 posted on 08/16/2007 7:06:44 PM PDT by RobFromGa (FDT/TBD in 2008!)
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To: Bigun
If you are referring to the flat income tax then yes I do but I SERIOUSLY doubt that YOU do.
The Flat Tax is a consumption tax.

(Why is it support for the FairTax and ignorance of economics go hand and hand.)
57 posted on 08/16/2007 7:06:57 PM PDT by Your Nightmare
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To: bahblahbah
That's $23 worth of taxes. The Fair Tax at least prices the cost of government openly. The income tax hides it. We'd pay LESS taxes if people were aware of just how much government costs them. Then again the NRO editors start from the proposition we're better off not knowing the price tag of government. To me, that's the exact opposite of a small government philosophy. I want to shrink government; not let it continue to grow through stealth taxation.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

58 posted on 08/16/2007 7:07:12 PM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: RobFromGa; Wonder Warthog
Another could ask why senior citizens, having paid taxes all their lives as they made income, should have to spend their retirements paying taxes on everything they use that money to buy.

Wonder Warthog thinks they should just take the hit. I'm sure the AARP will get 100% behing the Fairtax. LOL!

59 posted on 08/16/2007 7:07:37 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Ignorance of the laws of economics is no excuse.)
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To: RobFromGa
The country did fine on excise, imposts and other indirect taxes until 1913. There was no IRS either. Its hard to imagine living in a world without an income tax. Our forebears did.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

60 posted on 08/16/2007 7:08:47 PM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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