Posted on 08/12/2007 4:30:08 PM PDT by RDTF
The labor pains were coming, so Jessica Hodges got going. The 26-year-old bank teller from Burke sped toward Inova Fairfax Hospital, but before she got there, the law got her -- 57 mph in a 35 zone. Reckless driving.
Hodges's labor pains subsided -- they turned out to be a false alarm -- but the agony from her ticket is mounting. She was found guilty of the July 3 offense and given a $1,050 civil fee on top of a judge-imposed $100 fine and court costs, making her one of the first to be hit with Virginia's new "abusive driver fees," which have been greeted by widespread public outrage.
-snip-
Anger and exasperation have been common sentiments recently in Fairfax General District Court, where fee-facing drivers such as Hodges have started to join the daily swarm of traffic offenders. After waiting hours to give their side of the story to judges -- several of whom seemed just as annoyed with the fees as defendants -- many nevertheless left owing enormous sums that they said would be difficult to pay.
-snip-
The fees, which range from $750 to $3,000, were passed by the General Assembly in the spring as part of a package aimed at funding scores of transportation projects. Backers said the fees would both raise money and improve highway safety by targeting the state's worst drivers -- those guilty of severe traffic offenses such as DUI, reckless driving and driving on a suspended license.
But the fees have since been vilified by an angry public (more than 170,000 people have signed an online petition to repeal them), denounced by lawmakers who once supported them and ruled unconstitutional by judges in two localities who said they violate equal protection rights guaranteed under the 14th Amendment.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...
Maybe "GDR-type of guy" might get it across to you better than "fascist".
If they are going to do this I want it applied to the undocumented tourists and to out of state Americans as well. It's only fair!
OK then. It’s a good thing VA only fines its stupid resident drivers this stupid tax. Feel better now?
What difference does it make if I live in Virginia? Did you limit the thread to Virginia residents?
Actually, some posters here are arguing that traffic laws do not need to be obeyed (as in the person who said it was “not important” to go 35 mph on any road leading to Inova Fairfax hospital and the person who said 35 mph was “too low” anyway).
But that’s neither here nor there.
I am wondering what, among the points I have made, you consider an “excuse” for the law?
All I am saying is that traffic laws should be obeyed and there should be a consequence if they are not. With that, you claim you agree.
Therefore, all you are doing is arguing that “these fines are ridiculously high,” and grousing that they do not apply to the other guy. Fine.
I don’t care that the fines are ridiculously high or that they don’t apply to the other guy. I figure I’ll do my best to drive safely and take the consequences if I don’t.
What’s your problem with that?
Good point! Raise the speeding fines to $5,000 for anyone doing 10 over and the Republicans can also swoop to the rescue by eliminiating state income taxes........What a plan eh?
This is pretty much my point and pretty much how it has to work.
The person who wants to, in essence, grant himself an exception to the law (by speeding, whatever) takes the legal risk in doing so.
If it turns out he wrongly evaluated the situation-—e.g., there was no medical emergency after all-—he’s likely to end up paying the piper.
If the opposite occurs-—i.e., the decision to break the law was in fact well-founded-—it’s quite likely leniency, even outright forgiveness, will ensue.
But we could never manage a society where people got off because they, personally, thought they “needed” to break the law at any particular time. If the facts bear out their decision, that is taken into account at the appropriate time.
Government has enough money, just the wrong priorities.
“The fees, which range from $750 to $3,000, were passed by the General Assembly in the spring as part of a package aimed at funding scores of transportation projects.”
If that doesn’t scare you, I don’t know what will. If they claimed it was a deterrent to unsafe behavior, maybe they could make a case. But since it is admittedly simply a way to coerce money from a private citizen, it is anything but conservative.
What if it is impractical and would cost zillions to try to enforce fines against out-of-state drivers, for example? Would it be worth it to pour money down that rathole just for the sake of appearing “fair”?
My “feelings” are hardly at issue here.
And, yes, I think it’s a good thing VA only fines stupid drivers rather than ALL VA residents having to pay a tax for stupid drivers.
As for the residency issue, if the state can show that it would not be cost-effective to try to enforce the law against out-of-state drivers, that’s okay with me. I’m not in favor of futility, much less futility that is expensive.
Are the missing three letters at the end of your name “off”?
What we have here is an effort to turn residents into a protected tax farm for the highway lobby.
It violates all principles of "equality before the law".
Think of it this way ~ what if the speeding, et al, special fines were simply lodged against out of staters. We could certainly secure satisfactory enforcement by seizing their automobiles and holding them in special encampments pending the posting of a bond in the requisite amount.
Would you consider that fair?
Cute, but deal with what is, please.
Assuming the state is, one way or the other, going to raise money for transportation, I guess you would rather raise taxes for everyone than raise fines for traffic violators. Is that your view?
I think I may come up and race the locals on the interstate!
What a hoot! (yea, i’m the stupid one)
“Uhhhh . . . is it more conservative to raise taxes on everybody or just charge those whose personal conduct is actually causing the problems that require more public monies to be spent?”
Said it before and I’ll say it again, I see nothing UNconservative about raising the gas tax, which in fact is a road user fee. You use the roads a lot, you pay more to use them. You don’t use them much, you don’t pay much. You drive a big heavy vehicle that takes a bigger toll on the road, you pay more. You don’t have a car, you don’t pay at all. What’s wrong with paying for what you use?
What this Republican legislature tried to do was disguise tax increases as fees in hopes that they could claim they didn’t raise taxes. And they were forced into this position by folks who don’t want “taxes” raised NO MATTER WHAT (of course those same people also want improved roads, bridges that don’t crumble, and less waiting time in traffic.)
No need to keep them around until they rust.
Doesn’t scare me one bit. I think I’ve realized for a while that traffic fines in general raise revenue for the state.
That neither scares me, nor do I think it’s inappropriate to fine traffic violators simply because money from the fines is then spent by the state for whatever it chooses.
And one of the rationales for the law has been that it should help deter unsafe driving. (I think that goes without saying that at least some speeders, habitual red-light runners and so on will think twice about continuing their dumb practices.)
How is it “coercion” when you only pay if you violate the law? Does someone force you to violate the law? Repeatedly?
What’s not conservative is denying that there is an element of personal responsibility in whether or not one has to pay these fines.
Do you have any substantive argument to make? I would be glad to hear it.
If you are focusing solely on the residency issue, I have no quarrel with that.
I have only said that IF the state can show that it is not cost-effective to attempt to enforce the law against out-of-state drivers, I don’t see why that would make the law “unfair,” and certainly not unconstitutional.
“Residents a protected tax farm for the highway lobby”? Consider: residents pay the bulk, if not all, of state taxes, period. The only difference here is that not ALL residents are being “taxed.” Only those who violate traffic laws and having to pay into the highway fund.
If the state’s rationale for limiting the law to residents is reasonable-—and I’m not saying it is, only offering, in the interest of refuting some of the knee-jerk reaction here, that it MIGHT be-—then it doesn’t violate any “equality” standard.
I never said you were stupid, but I’ll take your word for it if that’s your stance.
What I said was, if you don’t drive stupid, why are you concerned about fines assessed against people who do?
And BTW, it’s not like all traffic laws and fines against out-of-state drivers are suspended. You come up here and race on the interstate, you’ll find that out. But these new fines are based on one’s driving record, which may be more accessible if you’re a VA license-holder.
If we did it the other way around (stuck the out of staters with higher fines than the locals) AAA would be running a campaign against Virginia being some sort of speedtrap. They'd release "Macon County" as "Arlington County", and so forth.
Personally, anyone whose fit to have a $3,000 traffic fine lodged against them is also fit to get off the road.
The General Assembly must have been blowing dope at their afternoon recess to come up with this one.
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