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Brown Surrenders War Powers to Parliament
Iraq Slogger ^ | 7/3/07

Posted on 07/03/2007 3:47:49 PM PDT by bnelson44

With British confidence in their leaders at a low ebb, new Prime Minister Gordon Brown assumed office last week pledging to undertake measures designed to restore public trust in the government. Following through on his promise, Brown presented a new plan Tuesday that would dramatically revise the Constitutional powers of the British government, with an eye to strengthening the checks and balances.

In his first statement to the House of Commons since assuming power last week, Brown said he would surrender to Parliament 12 powers traditionally reserved for the prime minister under the "Royal prerogative," including the power to declare war, along with the power to dissolve the House, and the right to appoint judges and bishops.

"I now propose to surrender or limit these powers to make for a more open 21st century British democracy which better serves the British people," he told MPs, to loud Labour cheers.

(Excerpt) Read more at iraqslogger.com ...


TOPICS: Front Page News; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: chamberlain; geopolitics; war
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To: Grampa Dave
Theodore Dalrymple has a new book commenting on the present state of British culture that is extremely depressing, but fascinating reading. Here is a snip from one Amazon review:

This review is from: Our Culture, What's Left of It: The Mandarins and the Masses

I am also a physician and have a good acquaintance with city hospitals in America. Things have not got so bad here but some of the trends are not good. My British friends do not believe that it is as bad there as Dalrymple describes but one, a famous surgeon in London, has expressed alarm at the number of young women medical students who are converting to Islam. These are not the children of immigants. What an educated women would see in Islam is a mystery to both of us.

This book of essays has already predicted the subsequent riots in France. His picture of the inner cities of England is worrisome. These children who are living such self-destructive lives are not the great grandchildren of slaves. They are the products of progressive education and the welfare state..

Our Culture Whats Left of It

61 posted on 07/04/2007 5:32:08 AM PDT by maica (America will be a hyperpower that's all hype and no power -- if we do not prevail in Iraq)
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To: pepsi_junkie

Will the Queen sit idly by?

&&&&&

What can she be thinking!!!


62 posted on 07/04/2007 5:35:23 AM PDT by maica (America will be a hyperpower that's all hype and no power -- if we do not prevail in Iraq)
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To: mdmathis6

Flexible police and military responses have nothing to do with a formal declaration of war though. We managed to retake the Falkland Islands without a formal declaration of war.

In reality it would always be difficult for a Prime Minister to declare a war without the support of Parliament. All this move really does is formalise the precedent set by Tony Blair’s debate and formal vote in the House of Commons prior to the Iraq invasion.


63 posted on 07/04/2007 5:50:31 AM PDT by JHT
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To: maica

Scary stuff.

I challenge liberal women, who hate GW and feel for the Islamofaciscts. I ask them what has made them so self destructive, drugs, sex with severe side effects or just hatred of life in general. Most just glare and never answer.

When I leave, I tell them to enjoy their Burkas and being shot in a stadium by Islamofascists for not being good Muslim women.


64 posted on 07/04/2007 6:29:44 AM PDT by Grampa Dave (Why do liberals thrive on bad news for America?)
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To: JHT

Don’t get me wrong, though I think allowing the legislative
bodies who are generally more representative of their districts a direct say in the need for war making is generally a good thing. I just hope their learning curve in handling their new powers isn’t too steep if these powers have to be quickly brought to bear on lets say a major terrorist nuclear attack!


65 posted on 07/04/2007 6:47:24 AM PDT by mdmathis6
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To: JHT
Regarding your statement that "We managed to take the Falklands Islands...", those islands rightly belonged to Argentina, period. Any objective study of the history of the Falklands Islands situation will come to that conclusion.

But about Brown's proposed surrender of war powers to Parliament, think about it! The power to declare WAR should not rest in the hands of one person, for history repeatedly has shown that nations have suffered the deaths of countless of its citizens and also the huge financial burdens of unnecessary wars, just to satisfy the vanity, false pride and/or excessive ego of one unbalanced leader. NO, let such an enormous decision be made by many people, not just one.

Remember the wisdom provided in the U.S. Constitution that REQUIRES war to be declared by Congress, NOT the President. Events of the past 15 years unequivocally show the sorry results of letting one man make that decision.

Granted, most all U.S. Senators and Representatives have violated their oath of office and ignored their sworn duty to uphold the Constitution in respect to this principle (to their eternal damnation), but the principle is sound, even though the congressmen show they are not.

66 posted on 07/04/2007 7:13:09 AM PDT by Patriot Son (Learn the difference between a Constitutional Republic and a Democracy -- and choose the former.)
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To: maica
She might be thinking that the monarchy is like a vestigial orgaan, its original purpose no longer relevant and yet it sits there still, useless. Perhaps she thinks that Brown's yielding of her power to parlaiment is in the best interests of all, and that before she dies she will abdicate and eliminate the monarchy altogether.

But I'll bet not. So will she sit idly by and see her own power diminished?

67 posted on 07/04/2007 7:17:14 AM PDT by pepsi_junkie (Often wrong, but never in doubt!)
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To: bnelson44

Britain doesn’t have a written Constitution - it has “tradition” - note the phrase “traditional powers.”

This new prime minister has also banned the phrase “War on Terror” and using the word “moslem extremist.”

When they yell allah akbar as the bombs go off - that’s very unPC of the bombers.

Britain joining us in Iraq was Britain’s last hurrah.

The British lion is in a zoo.


68 posted on 07/04/2007 7:22:46 AM PDT by Basheva
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To: bnelson44

Another step in the West’s surrender to Satan.


69 posted on 07/04/2007 7:23:10 AM PDT by G Larry (Only strict constructionists on the Supreme Court!)
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To: Patriot Son

“Regarding your statement that “We managed to take the Falklands Islands...”, those islands rightly belonged to Argentina, period. Any objective study of the history of the Falklands Islands situation will come to that conclusion.”

Bahaha! Not really within the scope of this thread, but I just wanted to take time out to laugh at this!

“The power to declare WAR should not rest in the hands of one person”

Yes, that’s what I said.

“Remember the wisdom provided in the U.S. Constitution that REQUIRES war to be declared by Congress, NOT the President.”

It was me that pointed that out above.

Actually it’s kinda hard to tell whether you think you’re agreeing with me or arguing with me. But maybe it’s just because I’m still distracted by laughing at your views on the Falklands.


70 posted on 07/04/2007 7:40:02 AM PDT by JHT
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To: pepsi_junkie

“Perhaps she thinks that Brown’s yielding of her power to parlaiment is in the best interests of all, and that before she dies she will abdicate and eliminate the monarchy altogether.

But I’ll bet not. So will she sit idly by and see her own power diminished?”

Her power? Although the power to declare war falls under the Royal Perogative, this can only be exercised currently on formal advice of the Prime Minister. If the proposed change would be enacted the power would only be enacted on formal advice of the Prime Minister following a Commons vote (ie much the same approach Tony Blair took to the invasion of Iraq although he was not obliged to). Hence no change whatsoever to the power of the Monarch.


71 posted on 07/04/2007 7:47:56 AM PDT by JHT
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To: LibLieSlayer

He’s looking like a cowardly dog!
The enemy is testing him, and he’s failing quickly and frantically!


72 posted on 07/04/2007 8:04:27 AM PDT by bannie (The Good Guys cannot win when they're the only ones to play by the rules.)
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To: TexKat
He also outlined proposals to lower the voting age from 18 to 16.

Oh Shiite. In the US we are in the process of raising the "driving age" to 18, or at least applying additional restrictions to those under 18, such as when they can be driving, how many passengers they can carry, etc. Meanwhile this idiot wants to extend them the franchise? That plays right into the hands of the Islamofacists, who breed like rats, starting as young as possible, and thus have a younger average age.

73 posted on 07/04/2007 9:32:26 AM PDT by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: Stultis
where is Winston Churchill buried?

That rumbling is coming from Bladon, Oxfordshire about 60 miles NE of London. About as "out in the countryside" as you can get in England.

His tombstone was replaced in '98 due to damage to the site by folks paying their respects.

74 posted on 07/04/2007 9:54:35 AM PDT by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: PISANO
IMHO making the QUEEN the absolute ruler is a better idea than giving Parliament that much power!!

Remember that under the UK's parliamentary system, the majority in Parliament selects the PM in the first place. They select him and they can remove him by a vote of "no confidence". Unlike the US system where the people elect (albeit indirectly via the electoral college) the President. The founders of the US felt that splitting power to declare war from that to make war, between Congress and the President, was wise, but in the UK Parliament has in effect both legislative and executive power.

In a way, this shift would change little.

75 posted on 07/04/2007 10:00:14 AM PDT by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: JHT
nteresting that Gordon Brown is effectively borrowing an American idea with these proposals and yet so many people here think it will be a disastrous move. Are you all similarly opposed to the above clauses in your own Constitution?

But the President is not selected by Congress, as the PM is selected by the majority in Parliament. Parliament already had a giant "Check" on the powers of the PM, they can remove him from office by a "no confidence" vote.

WHile Congress can remove the President, it cannot do so simpily because they don't like his polices. The situations are not comparable.

Also at the time the US Constitution was written, the King, and not the PM had the power to declare war. We didn't like Kings and were not about to make the President an elected King. The President is the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces, as was the King of England at the time.

76 posted on 07/04/2007 10:06:39 AM PDT by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: LibLieSlayer

His first reaction to the new terrorist attempt in england was to kiss the collective asses of all the Muslims in the IK .
What a supreme jerk off this guy is . England is lost and probably deserves to get blow up .


77 posted on 07/04/2007 10:09:56 AM PDT by sonic109
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To: Patriot Son
Regarding your statement that "We managed to take the Falklands Islands...", those islands rightly belonged to Argentina, period.

The people who live there would beg to disagree.

78 posted on 07/04/2007 10:11:42 AM PDT by El Gato ("The Second Amendment is the RESET button of the United States Constitution." -- Doug McKay)
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To: El Gato

“The situations are not comparable”

Maybe or maybe not. People are not criticising that on this basis, but posting (with greater or lesser degrees of hysteria) that removing this power from the executive is somekind of death knell for the UK and will affect our ability to defend ourselves. In actual fact, most Western democracies, including the US, vest this power in the legislative rather than the executive branch.


79 posted on 07/04/2007 10:14:09 AM PDT by JHT
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To: sonic109

“What a supreme jerk off this guy is . England is lost and probably deserves to get blow up.”

What a supreme jerk off you are...


80 posted on 07/04/2007 10:15:39 AM PDT by JHT
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