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To: EternalVigilance
Yes I am aware of the 14th amendment. But at the time of the decision I was a wet-behind-the ears child, and that was the only way I could make sense out of nonsense. I so believed in my country that I never thought this situation would go uncorrected.

But also careful reading of the 14th amendment shows that “no state” shall deprive any person of life without due process, nor deny equal protection. Hence the Federal government is limiting what a STATE can do with respect to death, it placed no such limitation on the US government in amendment 14-Look at the 15th for comparison. And no where in the constitution, does it say a fetus is a person. Slaves were only 3 fifths of a person, and all kinds of laws were passed to impinge on their rights in spite of the 15th amendment.

A history professor of mine once noted that we have continued throughout our history to redefine the word person. It is way past time for the unborn baby to be defined as a person.

I have read that at the time of the 13 colonies, abortion was allowed before the quickening which I believe is about 5 weeks. This was before modern science. I believe that the science of today clearly demonstrates that unborn babies are children and should be afforded the protection of all persons and citizens.

128 posted on 06/18/2007 1:49:01 AM PDT by greeneyes (Moderation in defense of your country is NO virtue. Let Freedom Ring.)
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To: greeneyes
A history professor of mine once noted that we have continued throughout our history to redefine the word person. It is way past time for the unborn baby to be defined as a person.

Then how would you define those that were previously defined as 'persons'? An unborn baby is worlds different than what we call a 'person' today. It might be deserving of 'right to life', but I think it foolish to nullify the substance of the definition of 'person' just to protect the unborn. There are more respectable arguments for getting there.

I have read that at the time of the 13 colonies, abortion was allowed before the quickening which I believe is about 5 weeks. This was before modern science. I believe that the science of today clearly demonstrates that unborn babies are children and should be afforded the protection of all persons and citizens.

Howso? Simple logic would have told those 'before modern science' that an unborn baby, one, was a member of the human species, two, was a future person, and three, probably physically exhibited traits we associated with persons. I can't imagine them thinking that the unborn baby grows up in the womb as a formless mass and then suddenly forms into a child a day or two before birth.

All this said, I'm very curious as to what our founders and thinkers of the time thought about the unborn. I've not seen many quotes.

133 posted on 06/18/2007 5:10:20 AM PDT by Swordfished
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To: greeneyes

“But also careful reading of the 14th amendment shows that “no state” shall deprive any person of life without due process, nor deny equal protection.”

Exactly. No state has the right to declare open season on the unborn. No state has a right to permit abortion.

“I have read that at the time of the 13 colonies, abortion was allowed before the quickening which I believe is about 5 weeks. This was before modern science.”

Quickening means the mother can feel her baby move. The earliest that happens is 14 weeks. We have known for a long time that the baby moves long before the mother can feel her movement. I am aware that movement can occur as early as 3 weeks from conception. That’s before women know they are pregnant.

The bottom line is that when a state permits abortion, the state is depriving the unborn of life without due process. It is the government’s responsibility to prevent the private killing of innocent human beings. That is what government is FOR. The Constitution may not make it clear for some people, but the Declaration definitely does when it says that we are CREATED equal (personhood and all).


212 posted on 06/20/2007 12:27:00 AM PDT by PatGoltz (http://www.seghea.com/emails/terrorism.html http://www.seghea.com/emails/iraq.html)
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