Posted on 04/20/2007 11:58:21 PM PDT by the scotsman
If one is going to be super critical one might question how the history of the Jewish professor and the story of his courage as well as the fate of his class was so available given the dearth of information during the immediate aftermath of the massacre.
We as a society are all too often willing to accept what we want to believe and label as lies those facts that don't conform to our wished for world view.
I would say that would probably be due to the fact that these students jumped out windows while the shooter was still shooting, and escaped. They probably ran to the police or a safe haven, telling what was going on and how they got out. I don't find that remarkable that the story was out 12 hours later.
You said — “Let’s just ignore the fact that Muslim troops are fighting alongside our troops in Iraq, Afghanistan and other parts of the world.”
Well, they’re not faithful Muslims then, are they? (for not killing the infidel...). See this...
The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies — civilians and military — is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque and the holy mosque [Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim. This is in accordance with the words of Almighty Allah, “and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together,” and “fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah.”
From the website of the Federation of American Scientists —
http://www.fas.org/irp/world/para/docs/980223-fatwa.htm
Read the entire fatwa yourself, if you want. It’s from back on February 23, 1998. I remember reading it in 1999. It’s still true today as it ever was — and — *even more so*.
It *is* the “individual duty” of all Muslims to kill the infidel. That has been re-iterated over and over again — all the way to the present. There has *never* been any let up in that idea.
So, these Muslims *are not* very good Muslims... (that you’re describing)...
Regards,
Star Traveler
Your welcome. It seemed very obvious and some members failed to see the obvious.
That’s a very clear and understandable statement that you’ve made there, Utilizer.
You said — “I have two close Muslim friends.. The only religious expression I ever noticed was them not eating pork. They certainly get drunk and party and fornicate and worry about fashion and have the same insecurities and doubts and often the ebullience of every other typical college student.”
And the *absolutely frightening* thing about what you just said — is — so did Osama bin Ladin.
FURTHERMORE, and so did Mohamed Atta....
It’s *definitely* puts what you just said in a *completely different light*....
Regards,
Star Traveler
You have absolutely no evidence to support your claim. You’ve pulled it out of your a—.
Do you think that they're like Christians as well?And what's an "ethnic Jew"?
You said to another poster — “You have absolutely no evidence to support your claim.”
Well, in case you didn’t notice — it’s the *other side* who is “making the claim”. I would say that it’s up to them to prove beyond any doubt that he was making a move to save another student... versus — just jerking around so that the killer coud see that he didn’t finish off the job.
A flopping fish that the bear sees and goes for, doesn’t mean the fish meant to save my life... (instead of the bear going after me...).
Regards,
Star Traveler
At this point I have to confess that as an engineer, who works with a LOT of Muslim engineers, I have a bit of insight over any Freerepublic member who doesn’t know a single Muslim.
I am Catholic. We tend to chose what we believe in Catholic teaching. The Pope says birth control is prohibited, but I don’t follow that requirement of Catholic teaching.
The Muslims I know here in San Francisco are all over the map. Some are fundamentalists and fast exactly as required for Ramadan. Some pray the required number of times in the required direction every day. Not a single Muslim engineer in my office prays on a rug, which I thought was a requirement of fundamentalist Islam.
I know a lot of Americanized Muslims who believe what they want of Islam and I only know a small handful who are fundamentalists who follow the literal word of the Koran. Just as I only know a small handful of fundamentalist Christians who believe people were turned to salt in times past and Noah’s Arc actually had 2 of every ant species, 2 of every snake species, 2 of every spider species, etc... to repopulate the earth.
Muslims are all over the map with respect to Islam. The fundamentalists are the danger. Most Americanized Muslims are not the problem, except to the extent that way, way, way too many of them coddle the fundamentalists, in much the way that liberals coddle pedophiles, abortionists, violent criminals, etc...
Then why not tell the story on Monday? The student was not shot or incapacited in any way.....
If it happened that way, would the student who is still alive not be grateful enough to proclaim his friend’s sacrifice as soon as possible?
If someone saved my life like that I would not deny the hero the honor due him by staying silent..
Why not speak up to give the other student recognition for saving a life?...
Why not let the bodies cool off first?
Perhaps everybody not quite as interested in the salacious details as you seem to be.
Amen.
I have many Muslim coworkers. That is how it is in engineering in big cities. We don’t graduate nearly enough engineers to meet the need, so many come from the Middle East, India, China, etc...
My experience mirrors yours. American Muslims are all over the map, from fundamentalist to Muslim party girls that would make Paris Hilton blush.
Most people are a little selfish, but not particularly harmful. That goes for Muslims, liberals, conservatives, what have you. The most damage these Muslims and liberals cause is getting caught up selfishly in the rat race or in some Utopian idealism and abrogating their responsibility to fight for our Constitutional rights.
But only a very few of them are actually dangerous in and of themselves. I am sure there are huge numbers of Freepers who have never met or known a Muslim and are biased as a result. I can’t really blame them. Ignorance tends to do that to you. Until you have a 1st hand experience, you are swayed by your impression of what others tell you.
Me against my brother.
By brother and I against our cousin.
Me, my brother, and my cousin against the stranger.
Secular and Moderate Muslim Americans need to feel welcome in our society, or we will never prevail against their fundamentalist brethren.
I agree. The flip side is, Muslims need to accept our laws and know that Sharia law will NEVER be allowed anywhere in this nation, at the Fed, State, local or city level. They must assimilate. We will treat them with the respect and acceptance they need but they must treat existing American law and culture with equal respect. Any Muslims who don’t respect our law and culture, and advocated adopting Sharia law here, should be deported.
“Why not let the bodies cool off first?
Perhaps everybody not quite as interested in the salacious details as you seem to be.”
And the student thought all that?
Two days ago you were demanding we believe that the students were too young to think for themselves....
And apparantly the student DID think YOU would be interested in the “salacious details” or he would have remained silent....
Calling them "fundamentalists" makes them sound so innocuous. Let's call them what they are - terrorists.
Really? Refresh my memory with a link.
That goes without saying.
Sharia law has as little to do with American law as Leviticus.
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