Posted on 04/18/2007 1:29:40 PM PDT by harwood
Just heard anchorette report this on pMSNBC
I’m also very angry that we even know what this creep looks like. Naming him? Fine. Enough.
But, broadcasting this lunatic’s rants only encourage future acts such as these. Pure insanity.
NBC just earned a lifetime ban in my house. Even for golf.
Watching this young man’s psychotic ramblings is stressful to anyone. I can’t imagine what it’s like for the young people at Virginia Tech.
honestly. i would not be surprised if he at least picked up on the ideology but truly i think he was possessed or obsessed by demons. mental illness and evil are two different things. i say this in part because of his ramblings and apparent hatred of jesus christ. how did he get into all this?? also his wierd blasphemous statements.
plus don’t you find it odd that a person could manage to never say anything? even when family or others tried to talk to him, he wouldn’t respond quite often. that is really odd.
Counterstrike I think is the game
Until we actually get to see this guys full unedited messages (doubtful since we know how hard the media hid the religion of the suicide bomber at the last university) he left both in the dorm and with NBC we really do not know what he is: some crazy commie DU type Christian hating terrorist, crazy islamic terrorist or just some crazy Christian hating killer.
But discounting the islamic connection at this point when we now know he Hates Christians, calls himself Ismail Ax and goes on long rants about immorality of this society, just does not make sense at this point. Unless there is an agenda behind it.
Until we actually get to see the full unedited versions of the letter left in the dorm and what was sent to NBC (Doubtful that will ever happen). His motives are nothing but speculation on everybody's part and that is all they will ever be with out full disclosure and truth (LOL) from the media.
You have a lot more faith than I do in this society’s ability to monitor individual cases.
If my child attended that school, I would not want to hear that they try to monitor mentally ill, dangerous, anti-social, scary students. I want that person off campus. Society is then welcome to offer all kinds of help and assistance. But there’s no excuse for pretending he’s just like everyone else.
I agree the school should have been able to expel this person. Once he started to display destructive behaviour (setting the fire in the dorm room, stalking, etc.), there should have been a mechanism to do so. IMHO, the fire should have done it. Perhaps they were not able to prove he had set it intentionally? I don't know.
There was a thread posted last night about how the Virginia legislature passed a bill recently that a mentally ill student cannot be expelled from a university after a lawsuit was filed by a student who was expelled because he exhibited suicidal behaviour. I looked for that thread just now, but could not find it right away. I'll try again This must be why they could not expel Cho?
I do not think colleges should expel every kid who has depression: they'd have to expel thousands upon thousands of them if they did. Some of the greatest scientists, inventors, artists, composers, writers, philosophers, etc., in history suffered from depression.
And I would not like to see every kid who was a bit weird expelled, either. Cho's behaviour was clearly beyond weird, and much more than depression was going on with him. I agree that the school should have expelled him, should have been able to expel him, given the constellation of troubling behaviours: flat affect, stalking, disruptive behaviour in class (taking pictures of others in class), setting the fire, etc. He probably would have done the same thing anyway, whether at the school or at a shopping mall or theatre or somewhere he could kill a lot of people.
The magistrate who deemed him "dangerous" recommended OUTPATIENT treatment for him. Some "dangerous" right? Apparently, he was not in contact with the mental health professionals long enough for them to get a handle on the true nature of his illness and he was misdiagnosed as depressed.
As Valpal1 said earlier on this thread, schizophrenia can seem like depression at first, before the therapist is able to recognize the dysfunctional thought patterns of the schizophrenic. Maybe the answer is that if a person is deemed "dangerous" then the law should mandate some specific time spent in a mental health facility which would give the mental health professionals a chance to diagnose and treat properly? I don't know.
More:
A forensic psychiatrist concludes that Cho was schizophrenic: What then leads you to believe Cho had schizophrenia? How he related to his roommate was just too bizarre to be depression. The bizarre content of his plays — mashing a half-eaten "banana bar" in someone's mouth, the hypersexual, nihilistic (death obsessed) obsessions in the absence of depressive guilt or tearfulness are another clue. The progressive decline of a period of years. Those with schizophrenia, especially in their earliest years, are not readily recognizable as such — their condition is evolving. But here was someone who, as early as 2005, was carrying himself so strangely that he was a spectacle. The depressed withdraw and disappear. Those who are so peculiar in their manner so as to be inappropriate (taking cell phone pictures of his teacher, speaking inaudibly, pulling a cap low over his eyes) exhibit signs and symptoms more indicative of schizophrenia. He was communicating in a rambling manner reflective of what we appreciate as autistic thinking — characteristic of schizophrenia. In a similar vein, Mr. Cho's stilted communication in his homicide note (deceitful charlatans — not the language of a 23-year-old college kid) is also the manner of a schizophrenic's communications, as is his pronounced delay in responding to questions.
This is not surprising. A lot of schizophrenics start to show symptoms in late teens or early 20s.
Link: http://www.claytoncramer.com/weblog/2007_04_15_archive.html#507098213652900487
My best idea at the moment? Once a student has been declared "dangerous" in a court of law (or even identified as dangerous by faculty, as Cho was), the university should be allowed by the state legislature to have a rule that the student in question must attend regular appointments with the proper mental health professionals and also follow-up appointments with school counselors or else face expulsion? This seems reasonable.
That way, the kids who are merely depressed or have some anxiety problems could get the help and meds they need to finish college and live productive lives. And the ones, like Cho, who are severely mentally ill and not getting the help they need could be identified and removed.
...then he should be gone. Period. Whatever else society wants to offer him, fine. But he should NOT be left on campus.
"Are you happy now that you have destroyed my life? Now that you have stolen everything you could from me? Now that you have gone on a 9/11 on my life like xxxxxx Osama. Now that you have xxxxxx your own people like xxxxxx Kim Jong-Il. Now that you have gone on a hummer safari on my life like xxxxxx Bush? Are you happy now?"
Seeking information huh?
Seeking information actually says a lot about ones understanding of fundamental concepts and principles. In other words, there is such thing as a stupid question (and a stupid person).
Agreed, but there is that pesky legislation enacted by the VA legislature following the lawsuit. I was simply trying to find a solution that gets around that. I don’t think there could be a successful lawsuit against a university where the kid was given a chance, but refused help and counseling.
NBC has posted a few pages of Cho’s (redacted) manifesto online : he does indeed mention 9/11 on page 2, although he casts himself as a victim, not as a jihadi perpetrator.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18186053/
NBC and everyone else that makes these clowns famous has blood on their hands. Release a name, and some details of an event like this, that’s all we need. Send all the rest of the junk to experts in law enforcement and human psychology, let them try and profile these creeps and use the information to prevent further attacks.
Too much money being made, so expect more of it and play the odds. 32 people out of 300 million, what are the chances someone you know will be killed ?
But lets face the facts here, this is a price we pay for the celebrity obsessed society that is America today, for the garbage they sell our children, and the immoral sewage we tolerate.
Yeah, I know, this mental case pulled the trigger, but let’s be honest, there’s a bit of that blood on all of our hands.
I thought from the get-go he was schizophrenic. But then, I’m not a psychiatrist. The forensic psychiatrists seem to think he was, too, though:
Cho Likely Schizophrenic, Evidence Suggests
Link: http://abcnews.go.com/Health/VATech/story?id=3050483&page=1
Still, I don’t consider this conclusive because, as you said, the field of psychology is complicated and we really don’t know enough.
Napoleon effect. Wow
Yup, the guy was stark raving mad.
I agree. My brother was schizophrenic and I could see it in his eyes and the way he was talking. He sounded paranoid and tortured. In no way does that excuse what he did. My brother was tortured too, and he didn’t kill 32 other people when he killed himself.
Pray tell.....What man in history attempted to do just that....???
You don't want to go there, no matter what the reason of the day is to do so. This is mob mentality and very dangerous to our future and our freedoms.
There are things that we can do. I have suggested a couple things, but the voluntary nature of our medical system must be maintained. It is part of our core beliefs as a free people.
Perhaps there is a price to pay for being free. Perhaps there always has been and will be.
Nor did mine.......A drug and alcohol combo took his life ten years ago.
I agree with you. I think the media focuses way too much on the killer and not enough on the promising lives that were taken from us.
However, if this thread is any indication... if the video had not been released, every paranoid person in America would be thinking it was a big conspiracy and wonder what “the media and the government don’t want us to know.” The tinfoilers on here are bad enough as it is.
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