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No U-Turns: Goldwater and Reagan were important leaders, but they’re not models for the future.
The Arkansas Democrat-Gazette ^ | April 1, 2007 | David Brooks

Posted on 04/01/2007 1:45:19 PM PDT by quidnunc

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Comment #61 Removed by Moderator

To: bilhosty

Why stop at nine posts?


62 posted on 04/01/2007 3:06:34 PM PDT by Wormwood (Future Former Freeper)
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To: FairOpinion
This is the dumbest piece of logic I've seen posted in quite a while. Your post seems to say that the GOP is already irrelevant, and now your proposal is to be 'more like them' in order to win. WTF is the point in winning if our leader is still going to be a POS liberal? Your 'logic' is absurd in the extreme, IMO.

It's been an established pattern that our society swings back and forth between conservative and liberal, from one 'side' to the other. If we are headed toward the liberal side again, why put the onus of that disaster upon the Republican party by having a liberal president preside over the country being turned into a cowardly, deballed socialist cesspool following the steps of the cowards in the EU?

If we are already headed in that direction, then nominating a liberal to head the Republican ticket is the dumbest move we could make. Let the marxist win and turn the country into a third world sh*thole and that will begin the movement of the pendulum back towards conservatism that much faster instead of the slow bleed track that putting a liberal Republican in office offers.

The other alternative at this point in time is to nominate a solid conservative that can win in 08 and you know exactly who I'm talking about. It would be best to put all of the GOP's resources behind a conservative that unites the right and also draws from moderates and even some on the left instead of your suggestion. Your proposal is to win at any cost, even if it means making the Republican party just as liberal as the democrat party. That will not fly with more than enough conservatives to insure that your worst fear will come true, that HRC wins the election.

Actually, I'm of the opinion that your faction has that goal in mind by having RINO Rudy nominated to the Republican ticket. You seem bound and determined to get HRC elected with your divisive candidate, IMO.

63 posted on 04/01/2007 3:07:59 PM PDT by Pox (Just say NO to RINO Rudy!)
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To: KantianBurke
Liberty includes liberty from Dobsonites.

The sooner we are clear about that, the better off we will be.

64 posted on 04/01/2007 3:10:20 PM PDT by Jim Noble (But that's why they play the games)
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"Maybe I should of said that I didn't know what all of the changes would be though what you have mentioned is not one of the changes."

That is not the point which I was making. There are certain truths that are timeless and do not become irrelevant with the passage of time. The Goldwater/Reagan principles of individual liberty and limited government are such principles. If they have become unpopular with the public, then conservatives need to find a way to sell them to the public, not fish around for a new set of principles. In the Information Age, rugged individualism and limiting the role of government is as relevant as ever, more so.

65 posted on 04/01/2007 3:16:41 PM PDT by rob777 (Personal Responsibility is the Price of Freedom)
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To: FairOpinion
Polls show voters prefer Democratic economic policies by 14 points, Democratic tax policies by 15 points, Democratic health care policies by 24 points, and Democratic energy policies by 20 points.

What are the current "Republican economic policies... tax policies... health care policies..."? Part of the problem is that there is no leadership in the party to create unity with regard to these policies and no charismatic articulation of conservative principles.

66 posted on 04/01/2007 3:17:13 PM PDT by outofstyle
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To: outofstyle

"The first destroyer of the liberties of a people is he who first gave them bounties and largess."

Plutarch


67 posted on 04/01/2007 3:26:37 PM PDT by mgstarr (KZ-6090 Smith W.)
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To: billbears

"But many 'conservatives' won't. Look even here. "

A very good point. We do have a lot of big government conservatives and a lot of nanny-state conservatives on here.


68 posted on 04/01/2007 3:29:56 PM PDT by SmoothTalker
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To: outofstyle

"What are the current "Republican economic policies... tax policies... health care policies..."? Part of the problem is that there is no leadership in the party to create unity with regard to these policies and no charismatic articulation of conservative principles."


A very good point that should be repeated.


69 posted on 04/01/2007 3:31:25 PM PDT by rob777 (Personal Responsibility is the Price of Freedom)
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To: SmoothTalker

They aren't conservatives, despite fervent attempts to rewrite their NuSpeak dictionaries.


70 posted on 04/01/2007 3:33:29 PM PDT by mgstarr (KZ-6090 Smith W.)
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To: ElkGroveDan

That's one of the most revolting comments I've ever seen quoted on FR!!!


71 posted on 04/01/2007 3:51:35 PM PDT by SierraWasp (CA is pleagued with a GANG-GREENOUS REPELLICAN GOVERNOR!!! He's worsened the Gray Davis' MESS!!!)
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To: Pox

"a solid conservative that can win in 08 "

That's an oxymoron -- meaning it's mutually exclusive. If you nominate a "solid conservative", he is going to be beaten by Hillary with a huge margin.

If you want to win, you have to nominate somene who is a leader and has crossover appeal and someone who can overcome the Hillary machinery.

An old guy with a folksy manner, who can't even make up his mind whether he wants to run, with NO executive or leadership experience, who even rolled over for John Glenn, is NOT going to beat Hillary.


72 posted on 04/01/2007 3:58:57 PM PDT by FairOpinion (Victory in Iraq. Stop Hillary. Stop the Dems. Work for Republican Victory in 2008.)
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To: ronnie raygun

Remember the Carter era just before Reagan we had high inflation and unemployment, higher taxes, energy crisis, double digit interest rates for home mortgages, Iran hostage crisis 444 days and a general uneasy feeling in the nation. Reagan exuded confidence, character and patriotism....maybe we need (gulp) another Carter era fiasco for America to wake up and reject failed liberalism....we need another Reagan-like leader as president.


73 posted on 04/01/2007 4:06:24 PM PDT by tflabo (Take authority that's ours)
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To: FairOpinion
That's an oxymoron -- meaning it's mutually exclusive. If you nominate a "solid conservative", he is going to be beaten by Hillary with a huge margin.

That is your opinion, and it is not shared by the majority of political analysts.

If you want to win, you have to nominate somene who is a leader and has crossover appeal and someone who can overcome the Hillary machinery.

Nonsense. RINO Rudy could beat HRC for the Democrat nomination, that is how liberal his record shows he truly is. Mr. Thompson most certainly does have what you call 'crossover' appeal, and that certainly encourages more on the right than 'crossdresser' appeal, IMO.

An old guy with a folksy manner, who can't even make up his mind whether he wants to run, with NO executive or leadership experience, who even rolled over for John Glenn, is NOT going to beat Hillary.

That's your factions opinion, and does not concur with the opinion of political analysts that believe he most certainly can win the election. I'll take Mr. Thompson's insignificant negatives, and that's from his track record, over RINO Rudy's track record any day of the week.

Alienate the conservative base by nominating RINO Rudy and you will lose the election either to HRC, or by having a liberal elected that will be just as bad as HRC, IMO.
74 posted on 04/01/2007 4:19:03 PM PDT by Pox (Just say NO to RINO Rudy!)
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To: Sherman Logan
However, the author is correct that voters today are less concerned about government power than they were 25 years ago.

Mostly because we have leaders from both parties calling for bigger government.

75 posted on 04/01/2007 4:40:35 PM PDT by Always Right
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To: quidnunc

Basically the same arguement telling us the Constitution is a living document or that the Bible is outdated. Right is right and wrong is wrong, whether it is today, yesterday, 20 years ago, 50 years ago or 500 years ago.


76 posted on 04/01/2007 4:43:40 PM PDT by Always Right
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To: FairOpinion

Your concept of oxymoron is incorrect.


77 posted on 04/01/2007 4:51:49 PM PDT by gcruse
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To: quidnunc
David Brooks- The NY Slimes token "Conservative" columnist.

That says it all.

78 posted on 04/01/2007 4:53:44 PM PDT by The South Texan (The Drive By Media is America's worst enemy and American people don't know it.)
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To: mgstarr
I discount those calling themselves conservatives that are big government. It's a contradiction. Those people are merely "national socialists", and we do have this type in the US as well. A perfect example, the French or most German so called "conservatives" fit this description. All their economic and social views are still essentially socialist, they simply have a very nationalist flavor added to it. So you will see them wave a French flag, they will ban foreign languages, have a pro defense stance etc. But they still subscribe to all the typical socialist theory when it comes to a state managing society top down and it's economy. You're dealing with so called "conservatives" who mandate by committee what words are to be used in their language! Are those people conservatives? No.
79 posted on 04/01/2007 4:58:12 PM PDT by Red6 (Come and get it.)
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To: Sherman Logan
Partially agree.

Reagan's legacy of minimalist government (more of an aspiration than a policy under his administration) is still a model for the future.

However, the author is correct that voters today are less concerned about government power than they were 25 years ago.

I also partially agree. I think Brooks is right in noting that tax-rates have been slashed and much progress has been made -- but as Reagan noted, he knew that the revolution wasn't completed by any means.

Where I really disagree is with Brooks looking at the polls to support his belief that voters prefer Democratic economic policies and health care policies... all he's doing is reflecting the echo-chamber of the mainstream media which has promoted these things plus global warming, etc.

Brooks also seems to dismiss Reagan's enduring principles: the vision of the shining city on a hill; America's goodness; the need for unleashing the power of the free people; that government gets its power from the people. These principles have gotten dropped and/or a bit forgotten. Those of us who yearn for another Reagan are looking for a leader and and communicator to bring those big ideas back into the American conversation.

Back to what I'll agree with him on: the next election will swing on "security" -- particularly security in the war-on-terror. And security will depend upon leadership -- someone who can take up the issue of defending America as a first principle -- not some secondary issue which is where the Democrats want to put it -- regardless of how it comes out in the public opinion polls.

80 posted on 04/01/2007 5:12:40 PM PDT by ReleaseTheHounds ("Salvation is not free")
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