Viking woman had roots near the Black Sea

www.aftenposten.no ^ | 26 Mar 2007, 16:12 | Aftenposten's reporter Cato Guhnfeld - Aftenposten English Web Desk Nina Berglund

[Dysart]

That DNA analysis is so intriguing to me and I intended to it about a yr ago and never got to it. And the cost is only, what, 100-200 bucks or so? Can you refresh my memory of the outfit that performs the test?

I do know my genealogical tracing has my ancestors from Ireland (Dysert O'Dea--hence my handle)~1300's, then migrating to Scotland, and on to Virginia in 1696. Further back, who knows? I must find out. Could be that Obama and I have something in common :)

[PzLdr]

Russia is named for a Scandavian group called the Rus, as I recall. And Vikings from Russia [and Scandanavia, went down the Dnieper to serve in the Varangian Guard - including Harold Hardrada, killed England in 1066.

[Tribune7]

[Oztrich Boy]

Speaking as an Australian: Hee!

[Verginius Rufus]

Years ago there was an article in Scientific American about links between cats of the Black Sea region and cats of the Hebrides and/or the Isle of Man...the theory was that the Vikings had cats on board ship with them on their voyages.

[blam]

"Can you refresh my memory of the outfit that performs the test? "

Go here, $107.50 total. It shows the path that my male DNA traveled over the last 60,000 years.

[blam]

"Any predictions?"

Probably a group from the same Ice Age refuge (Franco-Iberia) as the R1b.

[blam]

Rus (People)

[Dysart]

"Can you refresh my memory of the outfit that performs the test? "

Go here, $107.50 total. It shows the path that my male DNA traveled over the last 60,000 years.

Think your reply was meant for me. Thanks a ton; you're the goods!

[Extremely Extreme Extremist]

Can you imagine riding that ship out in the treacherous waters of the North Atlantic? I mean right underneath the Arctic Circle? That took some titanium balls.

[blam]

"Think your reply was meant for me. Thanks a ton; you're the goods!"

You're correct and you're welcome.

I have an excellent suggestion to go with your DNA results...it is a book by Professon Stephen Oppenheimer: Origins Of The British

"Stephen Oppenheimer shows us, in his meticulous analysis, that there is in truth a deep genetic line dividing the English from the rest of the British people but that, fascinatingly, the roots of that separate identity go back not 1500 years but 6,000.The real story of the British peoples is one of extraordinary continuity and enduring lineage that has survived all onslaughts."

[Dysart]

I'm mindful of your past recommendations on Oppenheimer's' other works, and this one is squarely up my alley. Will pick it up soon. I always appreciate your tips/posts that also interest me, and no doubt, countless lurkers.

[Sawdring]

It was Barbarian week last week on the Science Channel and they described one of the Viking's more gruesome techniques of torture called the Blood Eagle. A very serious way to spread fear in the hearts of the Anglos, Saxons, Picts, and/or Normans.

[Ditter]

Still haven't sent off mine and my brothers DNA yet. Soon I hope.

[SunkenCiv]

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Varangians:

Google

[SunkenCiv]

Thanks for the pings!

GoLightly: (I was kinda waiting for SunkenCiv's likely related links, cuz he always seems to be able to pull up good stuff from his archives that help to round out info in newer articles.)

Hey, thanks! I quick looked up something for the previous post, then noticed about three or four others had already mentioned it, so, I've got nothin'. Checking the hard drive... nope, all I have that's relevant is this:

The Story of Harald Hardrada
by "Kafka2"
Aug 31, 2003 11:09 PM

He stopped running when he reached Constantinople, and enlisted into the Varangian bodyguard of the Byzantine Emperor, Michael IV. Once again, his ability to turn opponents into wobbly piles of offal was noted with approval by his employer, and he fought with notable heroics in Sicily and Bulgaria. With meteoric speed he was promoted to leader of the Imperial Bodyguard, though once again his dangly bits had a significant part to play.

According to the tale, in order to avoid a cavalry charge during their retreat from Sicily, the Saracens covered the ground with broken pottery. Harald had his riders pull down palm fronds and wrap the hooves and lower legs of their horses, then led the charge. At the very end of his life, at the parley preceding the Battle of Stamford Bridge, the English King Harold II offered Hardraada "six feet of English soil, or however much taller he stands than other men". He turned down the offer, but got it anyway. ;') He was the quintessential Viking, probably because he had a great biographer. (':

[SunkenCiv]

ah, here's what I was loki-ing for:

http://www.wretch.cc/blog/Heruler&article_id=6196418

(2) An eye-witness account by the Arab Ibn Fadlan during the years AD 921-922.  Ibn Fadlan served as secretary of an embassy from the Caliphate of Baghdad to the Bulgars of the middle Volga.  The eastern branch of the Vikings called the Rus (whose kingdom later gave the name Russia) had set up a camp and trading post in what would become the town of Bulgar, frequented by Arab traders. Ibn Fadlan's whole account of his journey has been translated into German and French, but never into English. Fortunately, the section on the ship-burial of a Viking king has been translated by a scholar H.M. Smyser in a paper comparing the ship-burial ritual with that in Beowulf, "Ibn Fadlan's Account of the Rus with Some Commentary and Some Allusions to Beowulf".  This translated section has been included in Gwyn Jones' A History of the Vikings (Ref. 3), making it more accessible to the general public. This is a lengthy account, including the gruesome slaying of a slave girl to accompany the king to the netherworld. Here I quote only the part on ship-burning:

"Then the people came up with tinder and other firewood, each holding a piece of wood of which he had set fire to an end and which he put into the pile of wood beneath the ship. Thereupon the flames engulfed the wood, then the ship, the pavilion, the man, the girl, and everything in the ship. A powerful, fearful wind began to blow so that the flames became fiercer and more intense…"

[GoLightly]

I was looking for the approximate date & I type so slow, blam had the article posted while I was making my post.

With the date of around 800 we're well into saga territory, where dates can only be guessed at.

Harald "Haarfager" (The Fairhair) was born in the mid 9th century, so it would be a bit too late for her to be any of his many wives & concubines. His mother was from Sogn & her mother is not known, but I think she could be a possibility. Other than being the father of Ragnhild, Harald Hairfair's mother, I can't find much info about Harald "gullskjegg" (goldbeard), but his kingdom would have been well west, making it more doubtful that the bones are those of one of his consorts.

Before Harald Hairfair there were a whole lot of petty kings ruling in Norway & many of them were related to the Danish & Swedish "royals".

By the eleventh century, there were Norsemen all over the place. I believe the Rus were Swedes, so I'd think most of the original Varangians would have also been Swedes. The Normans are believed to have branched out of the Orkney's, so they would have been originally from Norge. I'm not sure about the de Hauteville's of Sicily, but I think they were Danes, though they could have been originally from Norge. It's hard to tell, as Tancred & Roger aren't exactly Scandinavian names. Throw in England, Dublin, Greenland, Vinland & Iceland... like I said, they were all over the place. People were a lot more mobile than we sometimes think they could have been.

[SunkenCiv]

All over the place.

http://www.familytreedna.com/forum/archive/index.php?t-2194.html

http://home.earthlink.net/~lilinah/Textiles/roger.html

http://www.bestofsicily.com/mag/art124.htm

http://www.bestofsicily.com/history2.htm

http://www.thepeerage.com/p11410.htm

[SunkenCiv]

Top O' The Mornin', Barack: Obama's Irish Roots Revealed
New York Press | 3/12/07 | New York Press
Posted on 03/12/2007 9:22:22 PM EDT by melt
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1799814/posts