[Doomonyou]

I find that the environmentalists change their tune when they are told that the public is not going to conserve but is going to want more electricity...and given the limited options that the public will accept in the way of power generation...get ready for some new coal-fired plants. They start liking windmills a lot then. And the modern ones don't really kill as many birds anyway.

Environmentalists are going to scream until the second coming about any form of energy production we currently use. No nukes, no more drilling, no more dams, now windmills are problematic, etc. They will bitch about ocean wave power (bet on it), and any other "new" form of energy generation until we can come up with a 2" square solar panel that will light up a city and works at night.

[P-40]

Environmentalists are going to scream

That they will. Even with something like ethanol, which so many of them screamed *for* for years, now that companies are producing the stuff, they are *against* it and actively writing articles denouncing it. (Kind of like the recycled straw man argument over corn) I did notice that opposition to these alternative technologies seemed to drop after our governor announced he was going to fast-track a lot of new coal plants. :)

[arthurus]

If wind generation were to become so efficient that it could actually economically replace oil the greenies would discover a host of horrible environmental disasters that would come from it. Their carp is with energy use and production, not so much with the method of its generation. These folks believe in a "sustainable" human population of earth of 500 million or 50 million or some other miniscule number and they believe that any method that can get to that goal is good. Anything that allows an increasing population to thrive or that maintains the present population is Evil.

[redangus]

The one key, foundational issue of all hard core environmentalist is “HUMANS ARE A CANCER ON THE EARTH, THERE ARE TOO MANY OF US AND THAT NEEDS TO CHANGE”. That is why any plan for energy, food production, medical improvements, disease prevention or economic advancement will be fought. They don’t want solutions to make human lives better, they want fewer humans. It reminds me of a line from Goldfinger when Bond ask Goldfinger if he expects him to talk and Goldfinger replies no he intends for him to die. This is where radical environmentalism leads, always and forever don’t forget it.

We argue with these people about how to make thing better for people in the future and they are arguing about how to have fewer humans to worry about. That is why they are so intransigent.