Foreclosure USA - US Housing Bust, Debt and Democracy Lost

The Market Oracle ^ | feb 25, 2007 | Joel S. Hirschhorn

[RobRoy]

I have a friend who thinks the "Thumb" is CLEARLY the best bass ever made.

Am I hijacking my own thread?

[gondramB]

>>I have to tell you that I am amazed, as my wife and I gain the "confidence" of more and more couples, just how many people, on the surface, appear to be doing just fine but, behind the scenes, have a massive student loan in delinquency that is forcing them to sell their home, or some other financial "problems" that are keeping them up at night.

A BIGGIE for many people is crushing child support and maintenance. The divorce angle and it's affect on those involved is not even touched in this article, but it is a BIG part of the equation and the 800 lb gorilla in the room.<<

I also see those issues - and they are real ans serious whether the person has simply had bad luck or has caused some of the problem. But in general that doesn't drop a person from middle class down to poor, IMO.

[ex-Texan]

Greenspan hyped ARM loans in early 2004. Mortgage companies saw opportunities galore and offered 1% option loans and even more exotic hybrids (like no money down combined with BS 'stated income' loans).

The Fed pumped up money supply and liquidity in order to create a massive housing bubble, which was used to drive consumer spending so as to placate and confuse an American population who had lost their manufacturing base and world competitive position.

Here's the Bank of England last week though, in a stunning admission on their housing bubble cause and effect. What they didn't touch on (yet) is that all asset bubbles deflate, all financial manias die, and all periods of low risk premiums reverse:

"Investors are likely to take advantage of this ample liquidity and the associated easy credit to purchase other assets, driving risk premiums down and asset prices up," the BoE told parliament’s Treasury Committee on Feb 20th."

More Foreign Goods Headed for Wal-Mart

What kind of a country are we when we no longer make anything, we no longer produce, we no longer save, we no longer have the ability to provide for ourselves, and we no longer have the capacity to pay back our debts? All we do is sell real estate back and forth to ourselves at horribly inflated prices.

"Nothing to see here. Time to move on."

[cinives]

They made Americans time poor and too tired to be politically active.

That's a joke.

[L98Fiero]

"Am I hijacking my own thread?"

I think that's allowed. The Thumb is great but I play a Corvette. I also have a special place for Rickenbacker.

[RobRoy]

>>Refresh my memory. When did the White House tell anyone to do something as stupid as borrowing more than he can repay.<<

Whenever he tries to "blame Bush" for this stuff I just skip over it. I can't agree with him on that. But I think he is really just blaming whoever happens to be the current occupant of that office.

[gondramB]

>>I would actually say that the term "middle class" is really an anachronism used to describe those who are neither aristocrats nor peasants, neither of which class actually exists anymore. Politicians, particularly on the left, like to use the term because virtually every American considers themselves part of the "middle class"<<

Isn't it interesting that the people who supposedly want a classless society often emphasize class.

Maybe the reason I perceive most people I know as middle clas is because I lack that strong desire to harshly categorize people.

[Calpernia]

bttt

[RobRoy]

>>Can you imagine losing $700,000 and not doing a damn thing about it but whine.<<

She did whine to her broker. His response was that a lot of clients lost EVERYTHING.

I believe she took it out of the market completely and put it somewhere "safe", if you get my drift.

Some were more hard hit than others, and more "punch drunk" as well. They may also be the ones that saw the greatest increases before the collapse due to the risk involved.

I agree that one could have built it back up with one caveat: Look at where the Nasdaqu is compared to before the crash and immediately after.

[RobRoy]

>>Wow, you are really a frickin wizard, aren't you?<<

Thank you! You make me blush. ;)

But seriously, there IS plenty of land. Keep in mind that much of the land now being used was not useable before. It is a hoax that land is somehow limited. Technically it is of course, in the same way that technically the earth is doomed - the sun will explode someday.

But it is not an issue yet - at least in the Americas. Not even close!

[gondramB]

>>Donald Trump says we hardly have any middle class left. He ought to know.

---

Why is that?<<

I had the same thought - he's an elitist who makes money - that's not really the best qualification what is middle class..


I may be the only Freeper that enjoyed West Wing but there just some brilliant moments - like when they are worried the President's numbers are dropping and they hyper-focus on thenew poll they are commissioning.

All the Democratic advisers want to throw out a question that has been used since 1900 because it contains the phrase "average American" -they think that phrase is an insult.

The one staffer who is neither a career political adviser nor a lawyer is the only one who gets it - she say something like "This may surprise you but 90% of American consider themselves to be an average American and they think that is a good thing. The question stays."

[RobRoy]

>>That's a joke.<<

I agree.

It is also exactly what has happened.

[Alberta's Child]

My point is that neither the city apartment/rowhouse nor the suburban home meets the basic definition of "private property" from my standpoint.

The underlying economic principle of "private property" is that it gives the owner/occupant a true stake in developing something, creating something, building something, selling something, etc. . . . and that this has always provided the best climate for long-term growth and stability.

Someone who lives on a working farm, lives upstairs from a retail store, or runs a business out of his/her basement is truly a "private property owner" in every sense of the word.

Someone who lives in a suburban home and works in a city 10 miles away may have his/her name on a property title, but the reality is that in the larger economic context, this suburb is not all that much different than an apartment complex or a company-owned town.

[RobRoy]

I liken Rickenbachers to Rolls Royces. I liken Warwick to Mercedes. I liken Ernie Ball to Porche.

Yeah, that may make no sense...

My latest favorite place to get basses is rondomusic.net. I bought one of their old style fender jazz basses with the big metal plates over the pickups and bridge for $139 on a lark. It has become one of my favorites, and the crowd LOVES it. Meanwhile I dropped it on solid concrete one day and it had no affect on it whatsoever except for a blemish in the finish on a back corner of the body.

I still feel a little queazy about pulling it out of the case in front of other bass players though.

I told a local guitar player (he runs a local jam and has been doing this stuff most of his life) about this place and over a period of two months he picked up three guitars there. Two of those are now his two favorites.

Something weird is going on.

[Domicile of Doom]

While I agree with a lot of what is being stated in this article statements like this one:

"The worst kind: Democraps and Republicrooks. Corrupt politicians care more about making corporations profitable and the rich richer. Economic inequality is like a cancer."

take all of the objectiveness out of the discussion. It maybe true, but no useful discourse can proceed thereafter if this is the tone used.

[goldstategop]

I have a mortgage but a conventional fixed 30 year one before all those new fangled ARMs came along. I pity the poor fools facing mortgage payment shock when their loan interest rate resets and they find their monthly payment doubled or tripled from its previous level.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[Domicile of Doom]

I'd rather a scofflaw who refuses to pay or can't pay due to foolish delinquency live next door, than a compulsive drunk driver, molestor, illegal alien, or meth cooker.

[silentreignofheroes]

Corporate America,,,

All Caps on SSN,
All Caps on Business (Corps)
All Caps on States abbrev.,

Corporate America is Bankrupt,,,America isn't

[rockinqsranch]

This author is firing a missle...everything is A-OK...elitism, aristocracy, urban sprawl etc. are in place, but his target isn't of any value.

Some discussion is correct, but too much is way wrong.

[Fierce Allegiance]

My buddy owns a drilling and blasting company. It's amazing where people will try to stick houses now. D&B is really expensive.