Elon Poll says Clinton, Giuliani have presidential edge

ABC ^ | Feb. 24, 2007 | AP

[B4Ranch]

>does anyone know of any conservative candidates that are running<

Hunter is a true conservative.

Free Republic Opinion Poll: If the primary were held today and your Republican choices are Rudy Giuliani vs Duncan Hunter, how would you vote?

Composite Opinion
Duncan Hunter	62.4%		1,796
Rudy Giuliani	26.9%		775
Undecided	5.2%		149
Third party	2.0%		59
Write-in	2.0%		57
Stay home	1.4%		41
Leave blank	0.1%		3
	100.0%		2,880
Member Opinion
Duncan Hunter	65.5%		1,102
Rudy Giuliani	24.3%		409
Undecided	5.6%		95
Write-in	2.0%		33
Third party	1.7%		28
Stay home	0.8%		14
Leave blank	0.1%		1
	100.0%		1,682
Non-Member Opinion
Duncan Hunter	57.9%		694
Rudy Giuliani	30.6%		366
Undecided	4.5%		54
Third party	2.6%		31
Stay home	2.3%		27
Write-in	2.0%		24
Leave blank	0.2%		2
	100.1%		1,198

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[flashbunny]

"But I'm also free to call them retards for allowing that woman into power because Giuliani doesn't think gays should be outlawed"

If you think that's the big reason for people opposing rudy, then you may want to watch the names you're slinging, mr. pot.

Reasons to oppose rudy:
1. Pro illegal immigration - fought to maintain NY as a 'sanctuary city' against the federal government.
2. Pro roe v wade, even pro public funding of abortions.
3. Gun grabber. Proposed federal 'assault weapons' ban. Wants federal handgun licensing - and I'm sure which will be as strict as NY city, which means it will be next to impossible to get a handgun.
4. Pro campaign finance reform.
5. Has a pattern as a statist willing to violate the first amendment - lost several court cases on those grounds while mayor of NY city

Then there's the other little things - kerik, questionable consulting things, "one in a million" draft exemption based on his absolute unique abilities as a law clerk, etc etc etc.

Rudy is one of thes candidate the MSM wants the republicans to run. You should be asking yourself why that is.

[Flavius]

hehe no

just that we all know that if push comes to show you have to go with the lesser evil

what are we going to do, bicker back and forth of what degree of the left Gul. leans to i mean we have months of this

i just pray to God some actual conservative shows up, country is split 49-51

and then depending on what persuasion legalized new amnesty immigrants will swing well then at least it wont be this

conservative lite situation

just my 2c

[spikeytx86]

To any and all haters that make their way over here I have a serious question.

Let's say your worst nightmare happens and Rudy does get the nomination, If he chooses a big Red Meat conservative like Hunter as VEEP would this help put some of your fears at ease?

[quantim]

just so Hildy did not get to 1600 Pennsylvania again.

Agreed, but be careful on the monikers!

[B4Ranch]

You say that you're a conservative. Why would any conservative vote for a liberal?

Giuliani/Clinton/Dem vs. GOP Platform Comparison
Issue	Giuliani	Clinton	Dem Platform	GOP Platform
Abortion on Demand	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Partial Birth Abortion	SupportsOpposed NY ban	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Roe v. Wade	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Taxpayer Funded Abortions	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Embryonic Stem Cell Research	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Federal Marriage Amendment	Opposes	Opposes	Opposes Defined at state level	Supports
Gay Domestic Partnership/ Civil Unions	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Openly Gay Military	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Defense of Marriage Act	Opposes	Opposes	Opposes	Supports
Amnesty for Illegal Aliens	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Special Path to Citizenship for Illegal Aliens	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Tough Penalties for Employers of Illegal Aliens	Opposes	Opposes	Opposes	Supports
Sanctuary Cities/ Ignoring Immigration Law	Supports	Supports	Supports	Opposes
Protecting 2nd Amendment	Opposes	Opposes	Opposes Supports bans	Supports
Confiscating Guns	Supports Confiscated as mayor. Even bragged.	Supports	Supports Supports bans	Opposes
'Assault' Weapons Ban	Supports	Supports	Supports
Frivolous Lawsuits Against Gun Makers	Supports Filed One Himself	Supports		Opposes
Gun Registration/Licenses	Supports	Supports		Opposes
War in Afghanistan	Supports	Supports Voted for it	Supports	Supports
War in Iraq	Supports	Supports Voted for it	Supports Weak support	Supports
Patriot Act	Supports	Supports Voted for it 2001 & 2006	Opposes	Supports

[spikeytx86]

Hey if some super conservative who is extremely electable comes out of the shadow then great. But I am going with who is in the ring.

Don't mind me, I am usually quite friendly, but sometimes I get prickly.

[M. Thatcher]

Thanks for that. None of us have seen it before. /s

[Darkwolf377]

You are so eager to trash Rudy you have completely missed my very simple point, Mr Pothead:

I'm saying IF the choice is between these two, there should be no contest.

If you want to sit on your hands and whine about having principles, thus making Hillary president, you're as bad as the worst DUmmie and I will consider you as much a traitor as any of them.

Don't like it? Tough. But at least try to reply to what I posted.

[spikeytx86]

My bad LOL, I didn't know someone went by that name here.

My sincearest apologies for that awful reference Hildy.

[Flavius]

thank you,

[Flavius]

no its totally fine

as i said if it comes down between the H person, and G

you have to go out and go with G

thats all im saying

[Darkwolf377]

I couldn't resist:

Reasons to oppose rudy: 1. Pro illegal immigration - fought to maintain NY as a 'sanctuary city' against the federal government.

And letting Hillary get in--which, if you didn't get my very short, clear post, is the thesis I'm discussing--would be better HOW, exactly?

2. Pro roe v wade, even pro public funding of abortions.

So what? Look at my tagline--I'm second to no one in my opposition to abortion. But abortion is legal in this country--deal with reality. How is having Rudy in the White House going to change that--how was having Reagan, Bush 41 and Bush 43 changed that? Public funding of abortions is of course despicable, but I don't see it happening. And besides, we have this war on terror going on--quibbling about abortion decisions that aren't the President's to make OR about those he can make is suicidal at this time. Sorry, but being an adult means making tough decisions--do you really think Rudy is MORE pro-abortion than Hillary? If so, please return to your padded cell.

Gun grabber. Proposed federal 'assault weapons' ban. Wants federal handgun licensing - and I'm sure which will be as strict as NY city, which means it will be next to impossible to get a handgun.

And Hillary is a Second Amendment fan.

Pro campaign finance reform.

Like our president. And if you think Hillary ISN'T...etc...

It's clear again that you simply ignored my original point in favor of unleashing yet another tired anti-Rudy rant. There are enough of those here. If the argument were that we should have a CONSERVATIVE candidate in 2008, I would be saying "YES! We MUST get a good, solid REAL conservative as our nominee!"

But...that's not the point I was making.

Has a pattern as a statist willing to violate the first amendment - lost several court cases on those grounds while mayor of NY city

LOL! Yeah, that Rudy did NOTHING to fight crime, clean up New York... This is unbelievably weak--you couldn't come up with five points so you went into this esoteric gobblygook.

You REALLY believe Hillary will be more respectful of First Amendment rights?

In the future READ and RESPOND to what I wrote. There are plenty of opportunities for you Rudy haters to roll out your tired arguments; a post about choosing Rudy over Hillary if that's the matchup in '08 simply isn't one of them.

[spikeytx86]

Exactly. If my guy doesn't get the nod I will still totally commit myself to campaigning and donating for the Republican candidate. Anything but HRC for me. To be frank, there is no Republican In this race I would not vote for in the general and not be excited about. A few I have doubts about electability but regardless, I would be checking R in November.

[Darkwolf377]

You say that you're a conservative. Why would any conservative vote for a liberal?

Uh, because he'd be running against Hillary?

[Darkwolf377]

It is not a matter of "selfish sulking", but a matter of conviction that I cannot vote for someone that is morally bankrupt like Rudy.

And doing so and helping Hillary win isn't morally bankrupt?

[flashbunny]

I replied to EXACTLY what you posted. Hell, I quoted you!

You tried to misrepresent the opposition to rudy to being about the "gay" issue in the post I responded to. It's a typical rino supporter tactic - borrowed from the liberals - to represent what the other side is opposed to in order to belittle them.

It's not about rudy being 'conservative enough'. It's about him being more conservative than liberal. With rudy you'll get 20% conservative agenda (tough talk on war and terror), 80% liberal agenda (anti-gun, pro abortion, pro CFR, pro illegal immigration, apt statist, etc).

I'd prefer people have the guts NOW to bring forward and support a real conservative candidate - hell, even an 80% one - during the primaries. But now anyone who tries to get the truth out about rudy and his liberal ways and states opposition to him hates america and wants the terrorists to kill us all.


It's amazing how well the RINO lovers on this board latch onto and use the same tactics the left does- the same tactics they deride when someone with a (D) next to their name is doing it!

[quantim]

Why would any conservative vote for a liberal?

Good question. Very good.

Better question:  Why would any conservative, to whatever degree, not participate in an electoral process that might anoint Hillary without one's participation?

Answer:  An ignoramus who cannot see the forest for the trees.

[B4Ranch]

I am praying that neither one even gets close to being the primary winners.

[B4Ranch]

Welcome