Rudy Giuliani: [to SC Firefighters & Police] 'A Woman Has the Right to Choose Abortion'

Associated Press/Newsmax.com ^ | 2.22.07 | staff report

[meg88]

hursday, Feb. 22, 2007 8:13 a.m. EST

Rudy Giuliani: 'A Woman Has the Right to Choose' Abortion

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Republican presidential hopeful Rudy Giuliani met with firefighters and police officers in this early voting state Wednesday, using the forum to reference the Sept. 11 terror attacks, which earned him national attention.

"The first people that arrive on the scene of the bombing or the anthrax attack ... it's going to be one of your brothers or your sisters or you that gets to do it," the former New York mayor told a crowd of about 200 emergency workers. "Your ability to do it well will once again determine if we save lives - save America."

Giuliani compared firefighters and police to uniformed military personnel and said the federal Department of Homeland Security needs to ensure first responders "have the training and protection you need to defend your country."

Giuliani has a tough road ahead in South Carolina, which is to host the first Southern primaries in 2008. His moderate positions on gun control and support for abortion rights do not sit well with the state's Christian conservatives, who accounted for a third of the 2000 GOP primary vote. Those voters swung heavily to President Bush that year, giving him a 2-1 ratio margin over Arizona Sen. John McCain, who was viewed as soft on abortion.

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On Wednesday, Giuliani reiterated his own position.

"I'd advise my daughter or anyone else not to have an abortion," Giuliani said. "I'd like to see it ended, but ultimately I believe that a woman has the right to choose.

"I believe that you've got to run based on who you are, what you really are and then people actually get a right to disagree with you," he said. "And I find if you do it that way, even people who disagree with you sometimes respect you."

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"We're a tremendous amount of time away from an election," he said. "We haven't even gotten to a primary yet. The best thing we can do now is organize."

© 2007 Associated Press.

[Mr. Silverback]

Oh, and one other thing, if it's up to the states to determine whether a fetus is, in fact, a person, why isn't it up to the states to decide if owning an African is really an example of involuntary servitude? If a judge decides that bipeds browner than a certain shade are not really humans and selling them as cottonpicking machines is therefore not slavery, who is the SCOTUS to say that's wrong?

[linda_22003]

You know that if Roe is overturned, all that happens is that the legal decisions on abortion go to the individual states. You know some states would protect the legality of abortion, so a huge change would have to be made at the federal level which would acknowledge all the legal rights of personhood to the unborn, for the first time in American law. That has a lot of potential "unintended consequences", and I wonder if there is any chance that would happen.

[linda_22003]

What Giuliani is saying is basically identical to what Dan Quayle said in the '88 campaign, as you'll recall.

[Mr. Silverback]

You know that if Roe is overturned, all that happens is that the legal decisions on abortion go to the individual states.

No, that's not true. That's simply the most likely outcome. If the Court found that a fetus is a person and therefore fell under the 14th Amendment, abortion would be illegal in the United States. A life-of-the-mother exemption would be inherent, since the abortion would then be an act of self-defense.

[Mr. Silverback]

Linda, citing Dan Quayle...not the best appeal to authority, knowwhattImean? :-)

[linda_22003]

Well, he was considered a conservative.... no?

[linda_22003]

But... but.... if the court suddenly "found" that... that would be "judicial activism" and everyone's against that! Right?

[upcountryhorseman]

Since there is nothing in The Constitution that makes abortion a Federal matter, it must revert to the States.
These social matters are handled at the State level.

[linda_22003]

I would certainly agree with the suitability, if Ross or Adams are actually family names of YOURS. :)

[MHGinTN]

And here I thought no one actually 'got it' regarding the notion of self defense! Love the way you brought that in.

[thinking]

chose what? the death of her child! it is difficult for me to accept that one human, can be judge, executer, and funeral director...all this dialog presumes, that the person is next to a God, given God like ability, to destroy human life.....that females are Superior to other humans, in their judgments...

[Elsie]

Sickening.

I guess I should have elaborated.

My point was that many SAY this is what happened to them.

There should be NO 'incest' cases without KNOWING who did it.

If an 'unknown rapist' does get away; then the lady can 'choose' abortion if she wishes.

HOWEVER, if she WAITS so LONG so that other, simpler 'medical methods' have NOT been 'chosen', THEN I say that the 'escapee' has caused the death of a 'fetus', and THAT is punishable by severe penalty in many states.

---

Put the DNA of the aborted child in a database, and if the perp's DNA is ever found in a future search, then HE should pay the penalty.

(Now am I a little less evil??)

[Elsie]

Freepers claiming to have fathered the offspring of Anna Nicole.

I did NOT!!

(AFAIK)

[linda_22003]

I don't think someone named "Elsie" would be one of the first choices.

[Elsie]

Any little girl christened "Dannielynn" is destined for the pole, unless steps are taken fast.

On raceday???

[LtdGovt]

If opposing the dismemberment of small children means I'm on a high moral horse, just call me Silverback the Singing Cowboy.

I did not say that the pretense was justified, nor that it was unjustified. I merely repeated what you claimed about me, but about yourself.

I'm pinging Elsie to this post, because I am certain that's not what he meant. Many pro-lifers believe that we should allow a rape and incest loophole so we can reduce the number of abortions, but only if there's a police report. I'm pretty sure that's what he meant.

And what if a rape victim doesn't want to do that? Many rape victims don't, unfortunately, for various reasons. You would punish them for that.

I'm pretty sure you don't know what it's like to have your arm ripped off, but you're willing to visit it on another person because of the way they were conceived.

Fine. You may come to me and rip my arm off, if you want. Early abortion isn't nearly as gruesome as you portray it to be. At some point, it becomes a human being. And then, you'd better leave it alone.

What other traumatic experiences are you willing to justify killing with? If a woman is raped by a family member, can she kill all the male family members who resemble him?

I think that killing the rapist will bring ample satisfaction.

[Elsie]

Potato?

Potatoe??

[linda_22003]

I don't see anything but a red "x" but it has nothing to do with racing (racing??).

[linda_22003]

No, that wasn't the "potatoe" campaign. That was when Quayle was asked what his family would do in the event that one of his daughters got pregnant. He said it would be a family discussion, but ultimately it would be his daughter's choice - "who else's would it be?" He seemed genuinely confused by the question.

[LtdGovt]

Oh, really? Is it up to the states to decide if the law of gravity exists, too?

You're comparing a physical natural law to an alleged metaphysical natural law. They really can't be compared. But yes, just like Indiana at one point said that Pi is as small as 3, that should be allowed.

A fetus is a life that arises from human reproduction and if left alone will become a little boy or girl. To say that it is not a person is on the order of saying that thunder is the sound of God bowling.

You're wrong. I assure you, if you take the fetus out of the female body and 'leave it alone', nothing will happen.

But, OK, let's go with your legal angle. The state where you live decides that bipeds who have screen names beginning with the letter L are not humans and therefore have no protection under the 14th Amendment. They issue permits allowing people to hunt them and get a $500 bounty. You'd be OK with that, it would be perfectly legal?

I'm not sure that would be allowed, since I'm indisputably a human being, while it is still under discussion at what point life beings. However, you're free to argue your point in my state, but I doubt that you will succeed.