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The ex-General Jaruzelski?
Radio Polonia ^ | 19.12.2006 | Joanna Najfeld

Posted on 12/19/2006 9:15:53 AM PST by lizol

The ex-General Jaruzelski?

Joanna Najfeld reports

On December 13, 1981 martial law was introduced in Poland. Phone lines went dead, military vehicles appeared on the streets, soldiers could be seen on TV. There was a wave of arrests of opposition activists who were imprisoned and persecuted. The solidarity movement was crushed.

University historian prof. Pawe³ Machcewicz explains what martial law was for Poland.

'The martial law was a huge military and police operation against the 'Solidarity' movement, against all the reform movement in Poland at that time. This military operation crushed 'Solidarity'. 'Solidarity' was banned and more than ten thousand people were interned, arrested and imprisoned. Several people were killed when the army and the police crashed the strikes and the demonstrations against the martial law.'

General Jaruzelski is the person to be held responsible for began in Poland in December 25 years ago, says prof. Machcewicz:

'General Jaruzelski is responsible for the martial law because he was the commander-in-chief of the Polish army, he was the Prime Minister and he was the First Secretary of the Communist Party, so he accumulated all the power in his hands. There’s no other figure that should be responsible for the martial law.'

On the 25th anniversary of the introduction of martial law in Poland, some Polish politicians proposed to strip of military rank those responsible for communist era crimes in Poland. They argue that this symbolic act could draw a line between Poland's present and future and the infamous communist times.

Many ruling coalition politicians as well as some representatives of the opposition are in favor of this symbolic punishment for communist crimes, provided that it is conducted according to the law.

However, there are those who oppose this idea. Among them, most vocal are post communist politicians. They say that general Jaruzelski should be left alone, as his health is in bad state. They also see the idea as populist and revengeful. For them, martial law in Poland was a lesser evil.

The proposal sparked a heated public debate, as, according to the polls, society is divided on the issue.

Rafa³ is in his early thirties. He was one of the 400 people who peacefully rallied in front of general Jaruzelski's house on the 25th anniversary of the introduction of martial law in Poland. Rafa³ thinks that general Jaruzelski is too old to stand trial but he should be stripped of privileges and honors:

'His pension should be reduced and he should be an ordinary soldier, not a general. It's a great honor to be a Polish general. He doesn't have the right to bear this title.'

Grzegorz is more or less Rafa³'s age. On the night of the anniversary, Grzegorz with a small group of post-communist activists was on the other side of the demonstration, defending gen. Jaruzelski:

'We are here to pay respect to the general and the difficult situation he was in. He was a responsible politician. If he had not introduced the martial law, we would have had a civil war in Poland and the Soviet forces would have intervened.'

However, history professor Pawe³ Machcewicz disagrees with the argument that the martial law was a lesser evil because otherwise the Soviets would have intervened. He refers to recently discovered documents from a Soviet archive in Moscow:

'We can analyze the Soviet documents revealed in the 1990s. According to the documents, the Soviets were not willing to intervene in Poland in December 1981.The international situation was very tense at that time. The Soviets were engaged in the war in Afghanistan, they wanted to avoid another conflict in the heart of Europe.

In my opinion it means that general Jaruzelski had more room for maneuver and that he was not under the direct danger of the Soviet intervention. He could seek agreement with 'Solidarity'. Of course we cannot be sure what would have happened if the martial law had not been introduced, whether the Soviets would have changed their attitude but certainly according to the Soviet documents, in December 198, there was no direct threat of the Soviet military intervention. This means that Jaruzelski's responsibility for the martial law is even greater that we used to think before we got to know the Soviet documents.'

A bill has also been proposed in the parliament to deprive communist era military officials of what as some people put it are unjustly high old age pensions. The old age pension of a Polish teacher with 30 years' experience is several times lower than the old age pension of a communist military officer.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: commmunism; jaruzelski; martiallaw; poland

1 posted on 12/19/2006 9:15:54 AM PST by lizol
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To: sidegunner; outofstyle; quesney; Brad's Gramma; OriginalChristian; Huber; Think free or die; ...
Eastern European ping list


FRmail me to be added or removed from this Eastern European ping list

2 posted on 12/19/2006 9:16:21 AM PST by lizol (Liberal - a man with his mind open ... at both ends)
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To: lizol

I was of the mind that the general had acted in a minor manner, enough to keep the Soviets from coming in full-speed, guns and tanks a blazing. I was of the mind that he did the minimum possible to keep the Soviets from storming in.

This doesn't make him a hero, but he strikes me differently than the Andropov types.


3 posted on 12/19/2006 9:19:47 AM PST by sittnick (There is no salvation in politics.)
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To: sittnick
He keeps maintaining, that the martial law of 1981 was - as he calls it - a "lesser evil" (in comparison to allegedly possible Russian invasion).

The thing is, that when the troops of the Warsaw Pact invaded Czechoslovakia in 1968 (the "bigger evil") - around 200 people were killed.

Which is more or less the same number, as the number of the people, who died as a result of the martial law in Poland in 1981 ("lesser evil").
4 posted on 12/19/2006 9:29:28 AM PST by lizol (Liberal - a man with his mind open ... at both ends)
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To: sittnick
I was of the mind that the general had acted in a minor manner, enough to keep the Soviets from coming in full-speed, guns and tanks a blazing. I was of the mind that he did the minimum possible to keep the Soviets from storming in.


Read this again:

However, history professor Pawe³ Machcewicz disagrees with the argument that the martial law was a lesser evil because otherwise the Soviets would have intervened. He refers to recently discovered documents from a Soviet archive in Moscow:

'We can analyze the Soviet documents revealed in the 1990s. According to the documents, the Soviets were not willing to intervene in Poland in December 1981.The international situation was very tense at that time. The Soviets were engaged in the war in Afghanistan, they wanted to avoid another conflict in the heart of Europe.

In my opinion it means that general Jaruzelski had more room for maneuver and that he was not under the direct danger of the Soviet intervention. He could seek agreement with 'Solidarity'. Of course we cannot be sure what would have happened if the martial law had not been introduced, whether the Soviets would have changed their attitude but certainly according to the Soviet documents, in December 198, there was no direct threat of the Soviet military intervention. This means that Jaruzelski's responsibility for the martial law is even greater that we used to think before we got to know the Soviet documents.'
5 posted on 12/19/2006 9:30:30 AM PST by JoAnka
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To: JoAnka

Good point. Jaruz.'s low-key demeanor perhaps colored my judgement. I guess in any society, one does not accidentally rise to be a Commie general. Von Trapp he ain't.


6 posted on 12/19/2006 9:34:53 AM PST by sittnick (There is no salvation in politics.)
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To: sittnick
I was of the mind that the general had acted in a minor manner, enough to keep the Soviets from coming in full-speed, guns and tanks a blazing. I was of the mind that he did the minimum possible to keep the Soviets from storming in. This doesn't make him a hero, but he strikes me differently than the Andropov types.

Wrong. These are the facts:

- Jaruzelski was told months before that the Soviets would not invade Poland, even in the event Solidarity gained power. They were bogged down in Afghanistan, and with Reagan in the White House, they weren't going to chance it.

- Jaruzelski, begged the Soviets to reconsider, he wanted a Soviet invasion, or at the very least, for the Soviets to keep invasion a legitimate threat.

- To gain support, he lied to the military, claiming that invasion was imminent, even though he knew otherwise.

Jaruzelski is a traitor, who should have gotten the Ceausescu treatment.

7 posted on 12/19/2006 9:39:12 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: dfwgator

See my post #6. You and JoAnka convinced me. Hey, at the time I was an 18 year old largely reliant on the MSM!


8 posted on 12/19/2006 9:43:15 AM PST by sittnick (There is no salvation in politics.)
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To: lizol

Well, now, lizol, sir, we've had disagreements about the lilliputian general before, my attitude being that of someone buried in the center of America, far far far away from Poland.

The little general was the lesser evil.

However, all that aside, I want to wish you a very Merry Christmas, and may the Peace and Prosperity of God come to you in the new year, sir!

And to Lukasz and Gregorz and the other guy too.


9 posted on 12/19/2006 9:47:09 AM PST by franksolich (mellow, sitting back, relaxing, watching the show)
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To: sittnick

That's what we're here for. :)


10 posted on 12/19/2006 9:47:23 AM PST by dfwgator
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To: sittnick

Or Putin, the first to use nuclear devices against a person living in a Western country.

Has anyone officially objected to that?

Why invade North Korea, as the Left suggested during Iraq? We should invade Russia instead.


11 posted on 12/19/2006 9:52:08 AM PST by sine_nomine (Don't let another Bush lose another Iraq war.)
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To: dfwgator; All


This is a unique picture, that has not been published before. Moscow, Kremlin, April 24, 1984 - Jaruzelski receiving platinium-golden Order of Lenin - the highest Soviet decoration, that was basically given to Soviet citizens only (no other Pole has ever got it). The guy next to him is Konstantin Chernenko.

That was a prize for the Martial Law.
12 posted on 12/19/2006 12:51:51 PM PST by lizol (Liberal - a man with his mind open ... at both ends)
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