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Megachurch pastor's trip draws criticism (Rick Warren,islam's newest useful idiot)
AP via newsobserver.com ^ | 11/16/2006 | BRIAN MURPHY

Posted on 11/17/2006 11:39:05 AM PST by Dark Skies

A trip to Syria that U.S. megachurch pastor Rick Warren says was inspired by a backyard chat with a Muslim neighbor has triggered criticism and questions that highlight the potential risks when preaching meets international politics.

But Warren's visit - which included a meeting with Syrian President Bashar Assad - also reinforced his credentials as a rising force in a new generation of globe-trotting evangelists following famous predecessors including the Rev. Billy Graham.

Warren, who shot to superstardom with his blockbuster book "The Purpose Driven Life," said he was not attempting to dabble in the hypersensitive world of Middle Eastern politics in the visit that ended last Sunday. Warren said he went to Syria as part of a three-nation trip of pastoral outreach and humanitarian efforts that began in Germany and wraps up in Rwanda on Saturday.

His statement, however, came too late to curb disapproval of his trip as word of it spread via the Internet.

Warren has been criticized by some evangelicals for holding talks with a nation long accused of abetting terrorism that is also one of Israel's fiercest foes.

Conservative Christians have been among the toughest advocates in the United States for a hard-line against Islamic extremism. And Israel is strongly supported by a vast evangelical network, including some American churches that believe biblical prophecy calls for Jewish sovereignty over the entire Holy Land.

The Crosstalk Radio Talk Show, part of a Christian radio network, called Warren a "mindless shill" for Syria and said he "owes an apology to Israel, to the American people and to the victims of Syrian-sponsored terror."

The state-run Syrian Arab News Agency reported that Warren's delegation supported Syria's role as regional leader and expressed concern about U.S. policies, including the war in Iraq.

"The trip seemed like a message that you cannot ignore Syria's role in the region," said Imad Fawzi Shueibi, a Damascus-based political analyst.

Warren could not be reached in Rwanda for direct comment.

But a statement issued for Warren, who founded Saddleback Church in Lake Forest, Calif., described the Nov. 10-12 visit to Syria as "neither official nor political" and said he expressed "support for President Bush, our troops in Iraq and the war on terror."

Warren, however, consulted with "Syrian experts" in the U.S. government before the trip, said his U.S.-based spokesman, Larry Ross. No other details of the discussions were available. Warren's visit comes at a time when the Bush administration is under pressure to reach out to Syria and Iran to create greater stability in the Mideast, particularly Iraq.

Warren said in the statement that the trip was initiated after his Syrian-born neighbor urged him to visit his homeland during a discussion "over their backyard fence."

Warren's meetings in Syria included representatives from Syria's Christian minority, professors and the nation's grand mufti, Ahmad Bader Hassoun.

"I believe it is a mistake to not talk to nations considered hostile - isolation and silence has never solved conflict anywhere, whether between spouses or between nations," Warren said in the statement Ross released Thursday.

In July, Warren postponed a planned visit to North Korea, which is under huge international pressures to suspend its nuclear weapons program. But he is still invited to preach in March at the first outdoor Christian event in North Korea since 1945, Ross said.

Straddling the worlds of faith and diplomacy is nothing new for religious leaders. In 1977, Graham preached in communist Hungary, the first of his pioneering forays in the Soviet bloc. Pope John Paul II, the globe-trotting pontiff who experienced totalitarianism firsthand in his native Poland, is credited with helping bring about the end of communism with his travels abroad.

Warren cited Graham and John Paul as models in an interview about his planned trip to North Korea with the PBS show "Religion & Ethics Newsweekly" earlier this year.

"People say, 'Well, you're being a pawn. You're being used,' and things like that. The truth is I want to get the Good News out," Warren said. "My reasoning is: why not? There are people in North Korea that have not heard for 60 years there is a God."

Mark Noll, an expert in American evangelical trends at the University of Notre Dame, said Warren may be reaching a crossroads.

His ministry and writings have only faint political undertones. But he may be drawn into a political arena by the weight of his own celebrity.

"There's a trend that religious figures - once they get a certain level of visibility and fame - seem to get pulled into politics," said Noll. "Warren is at this stage. The question is whether he is looking for new worlds to conquer."


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: rickwarren
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To: My2Cents

Love that "walkin on the water" picture. It always makes me laugh.


41 posted on 11/17/2006 12:55:01 PM PST by 444Flyer ((In Memory, HMC USN Mr. Sullivan "Lead, follow or get the Hell out of the way!")
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To: Cecily

ZING -- Good one!


42 posted on 11/17/2006 12:58:49 PM PST by My2Cents
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To: Jedidah

The punishment for spreading the Good News in a Muslim country is death.
I don't think the boy was doing any preaching.


43 posted on 11/17/2006 1:00:08 PM PST by em2vn
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To: Cecily
Rick Warren has as much in common with St. Paul as Bill Clinton does with Abraham Lincoln.

Warren is probably being paid a nice sum for his little trips to the Axis of Evil membership. He is close to becoming another Jesse Jackson.

To paraphrase Adali Stevenson, "I find Paul appealing and Warren appalling.
44 posted on 11/17/2006 1:03:45 PM PST by Patrick1
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To: Dark Skies

I have huge doubts about a globe trotting new age "minister" playing international diplomacy with a country we could go to war with.

First Ted Haggard, of 30 million evangelical televangelist fame, now this guy.

I think some people get way too full of themselves.

In Warren's case, I seriously boubt he has devoted hours to study of true islam, like many on FR have.

Therefore he may believe the lie (taqqiyah) that islam is truly peaceful.


45 posted on 11/17/2006 1:06:34 PM PST by truth_seeker
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To: Jedidah
Yes, I agree Godspeed Pastor Warren's efforts to bring the Mideast the "Good News."
46 posted on 11/17/2006 1:16:15 PM PST by shrinkermd
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To: Cecily

Well said, Cecily.


47 posted on 11/17/2006 1:30:19 PM PST by FarRightFanatic
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To: Cecily; hiho hiho

More like "when in Rome, do as the Romans do," or, as Paul said it in I Cor. 9: 22, "I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some."

Casual dress in California is the norm. Suit and tie when meeting with a high government official is appropriate. Don't you imagine Paul in his dress toga standing before Agrippa?

Easy for us sluggards to sit on our lazy back sides and criticize those who are at least trying to present the face of Jesus to a wicked world.

Frankly, I don't care what the messenger wears as long as it's decent.


48 posted on 11/17/2006 2:13:25 PM PST by Jedidah
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To: Obadiah

"let's not stand back her and cast stones at him"

Who's casting stones?


49 posted on 11/17/2006 2:19:53 PM PST by RoadTest ( He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches. -Rev. 3:6)
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To: Jedidah

"Godspeed to Warren and any other Christian willing to visit a part of the world desperately in need of the good news he teaches.zZ"

They don't want the Good News in Syria, Saudi Arabia or in any of Israel's enemies' countries. Rick Warren's visit simply enabled Syria to use the heft of his fame for their Satanic purposes.


50 posted on 11/17/2006 2:22:06 PM PST by RoadTest ( He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches. -Rev. 3:6)
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To: BooBoo1000
He is receiving the same treatment Paul

Since real Bible study is evidently passe, I'll have to remind you that Paul made the people of Damascus so mad, that his friends had to lower him over the walls at night in a basket, to escape being killed.

Yes, THAT Damascus. It's right there in the Book - the Book that people should be reading, instead of Rick Warren's book.
51 posted on 11/17/2006 2:26:54 PM PST by horse_doc
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To: RoadTest

I didn't suggest that they WANT it. I said they NEED it. And I applaud anyone with the courage to try.

As I said in an earlier post, it's easy for us armchair Christians to sit back and criticize behind our firewalls. Eating our own, for shame.

When Christ said, "Do not judge," he wasn't talking about saying when sin is sin. He said not to judge a brother. Who on this thread is so full of himself as to judge Warren's motives when he's making an effort that most of us would never attempt?


52 posted on 11/17/2006 2:32:03 PM PST by Jedidah
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To: Jedidah

How do you know we would never attempt it? You have no idea what people here do or have done. I have told the real Gospel to Muslims I have met in my city and to Muslims who were curious and wanted to talk to me in Jerusalem.


53 posted on 11/17/2006 2:41:47 PM PST by Cecily (`)
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To: Jedidah

"Casual dress in California is the norm."

I go to California regularly, I have seen some very expensive suits -- probably more suits than Hawaiian shirts!


"Suit and tie when meeting with a high government official is appropriate."

And that is exactly the point.

Does God "dress" up?

Rev 4:2 And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne.
Rev 4:3 And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and there was a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald


54 posted on 11/17/2006 2:51:04 PM PST by hiho hiho
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To: Cecily

The Syrian Dictator and this clown should get along....they have something in common: They're both con men.....


55 posted on 11/17/2006 2:52:19 PM PST by RVN Airplane Driver ("To be born into freedom is an accident; to die in freedom is an obligation..POW input)
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To: Cecily

Excellent. Thank you for spreading the Good News. Let's continue to encourage all those who make the effort.


56 posted on 11/17/2006 3:00:42 PM PST by Jedidah
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To: Dark Skies

Why is "Islam" in the title of this thread? Syria is run by the Alawi, and they are simply not Moslems.


57 posted on 11/17/2006 4:38:02 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah
Hey muawiyah...still deconstructing, eh. Here's a nice link about the connection between Ali and Mo. My question to you is...why. Is it vanity?

http://i-cias.com/e.o/alawites.htm
58 posted on 11/17/2006 5:16:15 PM PST by Dark Skies ("He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that" ... John Stuart Mill)
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To: Dark Skies
Gee whiz guy, I live in a neighborhood choc full of Moslems of all sorts and they have general agreement that Alawites ARE NOT MOSLEM.

No doubt there are Alawites who think they are.

A lot of the criticism focuses on the Alawi celebrating Christmas, Epiphany and Nawruz.

Technically speaking Alawism is a syncretic religion that combines elements of several other religions, e.g. Judaism, Christianity and Islam. The Sikhs do something similar with Islam and Hinduism, and the Canadian United church merges "least common denominator" elements of various Protestant groups to come up with something far less robust than the entity created by the Sikhs.

This approach to religion can be good, or bad, depending on the status of the devout in the greater society.

For the moment I'll stick with the opinion of the greater part of Islam, both Shia and Sunni, that Alawite beliefs fall outside the pale of Moslem Orthodoxy.

59 posted on 11/17/2006 5:34:31 PM PST by muawiyah
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To: muawiyah
There you are...still deconstructing...taqiyyah, eh.

You are either an apologist or the enemy.

It is a credit to FR that you are still here.

Don't remember me, do you? I don't actually care...just surprised at your lack of concern for fellow humans. Imagine what the planet would look like if mohammedans (sharia) were the law.

What a joke!

60 posted on 11/17/2006 6:03:24 PM PST by Dark Skies ("He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that" ... John Stuart Mill)
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