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Forget democracy and bring home troops, Bush will hear
UK Telegraph ^ | Nov. 12, 2006 | Philip Sherwell

Posted on 11/11/2006 5:38:22 PM PST by FairOpinion

A commission of experts appointed by President George W Bush will advise him to abandon his dream of cementing a new democratic system in Iraq and instead tackle the security crisis so that the withdrawal of American troops can begin.

The advice from the Iraq Study Group, a high-level bipartisan panel headed by James Baker, the former Republican secretary of state, will sideline the so-called Bush doctrine of spreading democracy in the Middle East. Mr Bush will meet the panel tomorrow and Tony Blair is expected to offer his views via a video-conference call on Tuesday.

Mr Gates is a member of the Iraq Study Group and has been a strong critic of his predecessor's handling of policy in Iraq and the use of pre-war intelligence. He will provide the White House with the political cover for changes that would have been unthinkable a few months ago.

The Baker panel, which has been charged with looking at all options for Iraq, is expected to recommend a phased US troop withdrawal, timed to accord with deadlines for Iraqi forces' taking responsibility for specific security zones.

(Excerpt) Read more at telegraph.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: baker; cutandrun; gwot; iraq; surrender; terrorism; wot
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Look at this thread. This gives some more input about Democracy in Iraq. I feel sorry when we are forced to abandon men like him and hand Iraq to the terrorists:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1737075/posts


21 posted on 11/11/2006 5:57:09 PM PST by SolidWood
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To: swheats
-"Somethimes you have to physically have 'boots on the ground' to claim or hold that territory."

Yes. I agree. But we NEVER had enought troops to do this securely. That is the part that we mismanaged! Or else we wouldn't be in the position that we are today. We only had enough troops to conduct a "blitzkrieg" campaign, which WE WON. The Iraqi army WAS DEFEATED! But then..... there we didnt have sufficient setup (nor popular support) to establish peace forcefuly.

22 posted on 11/11/2006 5:57:50 PM PST by The Bronze Titan
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To: The Bronze Titan

I have said before on other similar threads, we should have tossed a grenade in on Saddam, then one week later pulled all troops out. We could have declared a victory, and that is what it would have been. But, no... we had to 'nation-build', something Bush had said during the first campaign we would never do.


23 posted on 11/11/2006 5:57:51 PM PST by gb63
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To: The Bronze Titan
Yeah…it's not like those Iraqis are Human or anything, just take the friggin' oil and empower another Saddam to safeguard oil production…how simple is that? Only Americans have Human Rights…right?
24 posted on 11/11/2006 5:59:15 PM PST by dgallo51 (DEMAND IMMEDIATE, OPEN INVESTIGATIONS OF U.S. COMPLICITY IN RWANDAN GENOCIDE!)
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To: Kozak
Yes. I think you are correct. If we cannot handle 3000 casualties in 3 years, our military might be the best, but the will is lacking.

I remember, back in the early 90s, the Republican party was against "nation building"... perhaps we see now this was a wiser philosophy.

25 posted on 11/11/2006 6:00:23 PM PST by PatrickF4
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To: proud_yank
Major American cities, which generally are governed by liberal Democrats and lots of gun control laws, have higher annual murder rates than the troop casualty rates in Iraq.

Ridiculous and obscene comparison. Soldiers who die in combat do so in my name. Those murdered at the hands of criminals do not.

26 posted on 11/11/2006 6:00:36 PM PST by leadpenny
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To: All

Just heard on FoxNews that the study group will also recommend holding direct talks with Iran and Syria.

Negotiating with terrorists always works. (/sarcasm)


27 posted on 11/11/2006 6:02:35 PM PST by FairOpinion (Don't give up! Start working on 2008 GOP win strategy NOW.)
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To: FairOpinion
Lets pull out, but cause victory first.

My version of victory would be that the Iraqi's fear us ever returning.

Reich havoc on the terrorist and damn the collateral damage.

28 posted on 11/11/2006 6:02:51 PM PST by right way right
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To: sionnsar

Correct... this is Vietnam all over again, after years and years of folks like me saying "No, it wont be" a simple Democrat Congressional majority is all it takes to make the US fold up like a cheap card table.

Something is VERY wrong with this picture.

We cannot be this weak.


29 posted on 11/11/2006 6:02:58 PM PST by WOSG (The 4-fold path to save America - Think right, act right, speak right, vote right!)
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To: Laverne
Laverne, "I don't believe this for a moment; Bush will not change his strategy"

The strategy HAS TO CHANGE! We cannot continue to send our guys out on 'patrols' to get picked-off! when the population and the Iraqi's are not doing enough to stop their own violence. I'm sorry, but this HAS TO STOP!

I supported this war, and would not change my views.

But, the IRAQIS have to step up.... under the threat the we will PULL OUT!

30 posted on 11/11/2006 6:03:10 PM PST by The Bronze Titan
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To: gb63

100% correct.


31 posted on 11/11/2006 6:03:52 PM PST by taxed2death (A few billion here, a few trillion there...we're all friends right?)
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To: FairOpinion

what fool would ever trust the USA again ?


32 posted on 11/11/2006 6:04:11 PM PST by EDINVA
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To: The Bronze Titan

Another mistake was allowing the enemy to fold back into the neighborhoods and wait to fight another day. But that's water under the bridge as they say now.


We went to get Saddam and that mission was accomplished.


33 posted on 11/11/2006 6:04:17 PM PST by swheats (BE STRONG. STAY VIGILANT! Our Victory still depends on you.)
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To: PatrickF4
our military might be the best, but the will is lacking.

Who's will? The will of the armchair generals, the keyboard warriors, or both?

34 posted on 11/11/2006 6:04:26 PM PST by leadpenny
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To: dgallo51

right.


35 posted on 11/11/2006 6:05:16 PM PST by taxed2death (A few billion here, a few trillion there...we're all friends right?)
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To: leadpenny

Not trying to be clever It's a simple fact.
When we had a population of 100 million we could handle 3000 casaulties in an afternoon. Rome with a population of 10 million lost 30,000 in one day at Cannae.

The military isn't asking for all 300 million to be involved in the fight, thats why we HAVE a military. All they need is for us to have the will to back them in the fight.


36 posted on 11/11/2006 6:05:16 PM PST by Kozak (Anti Shahada: " There is no God named Allah, and Muhammed is his False Prophet")
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To: leadpenny

The will of the American public. At least of the slim majority that voted Democrap and kicked us all into the abyss.


37 posted on 11/11/2006 6:05:58 PM PST by SolidWood
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To: dgallo51
-"Yeah…it's not like those Iraqis are Human or anything, just take the friggin' oil and empower another Saddam to safeguard oil production…how simple is that? Only Americans have Human Rights…right?"

Sorry, but our "Americans" are worth alot. We fought for our freedom. We've done MORE THAN ENOUGH for the Iraqis. NOW LET THEM FIGHT FOR THEIRS AGAINST THEIR OWN!

38 posted on 11/11/2006 6:07:17 PM PST by The Bronze Titan
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To: The Bronze Titan

The strategy HAS TO CHANGE! We cannot continue to send our guys out on 'patrols' to get picked-off! when the population and the Iraqi's are not doing enough to stop their own violence. I'm sorry, but this HAS TO STOP!

I guess its a matter of semantics, our guys on patrol is not a strategic matter but a tactical one. When I say the strategy won't change, I mean to say that we will not cut and run, we will not stand down before they can stand up. I agree with pushing them harder and harder to take on more of their own battle, but that is a tactic maneuver, not a strategic one.

I don't think Gates would have taken the job to find a way out without first winning and that is what I meant. The media is trying to spin this whole story as one where the cut and run crowd is victorious and that is not the strategy that Bush or Gates will follow.


39 posted on 11/11/2006 6:08:22 PM PST by Laverne
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To: Laverne

I hope you are right, but I fear otherwise. the people taking the helm in key positions (Gates in DoD) are exactly of the nature to put withdrawal ahead of Iraq's security. If Iraq spins out of control, we will declare ourselve unable to fix a 'civil war' and bug out.


"We will pursue the same goals as before: an Iraqi government that can defend itself, sustain itself and govern itself and be an ally on the war on terror"

I hope so, and I am sure that will continue to be official policy. The question is whether we have a 'whatever it takes ' attitude.

A few weeks back, Rumsfeld accepted the (correct) reccommendation to increase the Iraqi army further.
There needs to be more security forces, not less, in theatre.

"He needs to use the bully pulpit a LOT more and I certainly hope he does. He also needs to tell the media and the dems to stuff it regarding their statements about our troops and this mission."

Absolutely! The reason the war got unpopular is that the Bush administration simply tired of defending against the repeated media campaign to undermine it.



40 posted on 11/11/2006 6:08:23 PM PST by WOSG (The 4-fold path to save America - Think right, act right, speak right, vote right!)
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