Posted on 10/24/2006 10:38:05 AM PDT by Dane
"Michael J. Fox admitted in his book that he foregoes his medication for political reasons to manipulate the debate."
Would you happen to have a link to that information? I would love to throw in someone's face.
Rush mentioned earlier today even with a page #. I'm sorry but I can't remember the page #.
http://www.mocatholic.org/StemCell-Cloning/QandAHumanCloning.htm
(snip)
Doesn’t Amendment 2 involve stem cell research? Yes, but it involves a lot more. Instead of focusing on morally acceptable and effective research with adult stem cells, the amendment pushes Missouri into embryonic stem cell research and human cloning.
What is morally wrong with embryonic stem cell research? As the term implies, it entails experimentation on human embryos – human life at the earliest stage of development. These experiments destroy human embryos for research purposes.
Does Amendment 2 pose harm to anyone besides human embryos? Yes. The proposal would allow the cloning industry to pay women who donate their eggs for research. In order to harvest the eggs, researchers would have women undergo invasive surgical procedures that are not risk free and can lead to serious health complications.
Isn’t stem cell research curing many dreaded diseases? The cures you are hearing about are coming from adult stem cell research – research that is underway now in Missouri and does not require the passage of a constitutional amendment or the harvesting of eggs from women. In contrast, the embryonic stem cell research promoted by this constitutional amendment has yet to lead to a single cure for any human disease.
Does Amendment 2 ban human cloning? No. The 100 word ballot summary voters will see upon entering the voting booth states that the proposal bans human cloning, but this is false. The ballot summary is relying upon a scientifically inaccurate definition of human cloning found in the full text of the proposal, which voters will not see when entering the voting booth. If voters could read the full text, they would know that human cloning is being authorized in the form of somatic cell nuclear transfer (SCNT).
Does Amendment 2 include a tax increase? Although the proposed amendment does not call for a tax increase, it authorizes the use of your tax dollars to subsidize human cloning and embryonic stem cell research. This could lead to budget cuts to other programs like health coverage for the poor or alternatives to abortion.
Why haven’t I heard these facts before? The cloning industry, funded primarily by principals of the Stowers Institute for Medical Research in Kansas City, has spent over $16 million dollars on a lavish media campaign and plan to spend millions more. There is no legal requirement that these ads tell the truth. Cloning backers are misleading voters and seeking to buy the election so they can access tax dollars for their research.
Your tax dollars and the cloning amendment:
Who would receive the cloning money provided by taxpayers under Amendment 2? State cloning grants could be provided to private research institutions like the Stowers Institute in Kansas City and Washington University in St. Louis as well as public institutions like the University of Missouri.
Without a tax increase, how could tax money be used for human cloning? Passage of this constitutional amendment would send a message to the state legislature that embryonic stem cell research and human cloning are top priorities for voters. State lawmakers would have a mandate to appropriate money out of state general revenue to fund these activities.
I take it from your post that what is being given to the voters is a lie and the real language of the bill is something else....
Stem cells don't come from the cells of aborted babies. Making these kinds of comments just makes us look ignorant and uninformed. Fetal stem cells are created in a laboratory, and it would be impossible to retreive fetal stem cells from a pregnant woman or from an aborted fetus. Having correct information is much more effective in promoting a cause.
So, if I get you straight now, stem cells don't come from aborted babies...maybe they just come from fertilized embryos that don't ever get to become babies. To me it's the same damn thing and don't EVER presume to lecture me with your equivocation.....you should be ashamed of yourself...
Uh they do come from a fertilized embryo that if placed in a womb would develop into human life.
Just a question medic. If you had Parkinson's would you use embryos fertilized with your sprem(I'm assuming you are a man) to be harvested for embryonic stem cells.
I'm 29 and I know quite well!
The term is human shield.
Yah, but that's a HUGE gap between 29 and 20. It doesn't seem like it to you, but trust me, when you teach as long as I have, you see that things only a few years old don't "connect" because of when people grew up. The ONLY president most of these kids really have ever been aware of is Bush.
What is the difference between farming stem cells from fertilized embryos from "laboratory created" embryos and reaping them from the womb of a recently pregnant female? It is still a selfish and dangerous dalliance with human life. To me, once the egg is fertilized it is a human being and don't give me that "potential" crap. Bringing in one's personal afflications into a decision that is, to me, a moral one is irrelevant. It's just selfishness, and a crutch to keep science from finding another way. Take the easiest path, try whatever seems like it would work, if it doesn't work, try something else. If engineers operated like that, this world would be in real trouble. There's a very good reason why they call it "practicing" medicine....
This is the definition of cloning:
(2) “Clone or attempt to clone a human being” means to implant in a uterus or attempt to implant in a uterus anything other than the product of fertilization of an egg of a human female by a sperm of a human male for the purpose of initiating a pregnancy that could result in the creation of a human fetus, or the birth of a human being.
A lot of holes in there. And why the heck should this crud be in the MO Constitution? Also I would not believe the polls. I think it will pass, but it won't pass by the numbers that they think it will.
Dane, sorry if I seemed to be venting at you...I was upset by what "medic" said, I typed before I reread your comment. It really should have been directed to him/her.....
For the record, I am not a man, but no I would not. I do not believe in taking innocent life, no matter what the purpose. Medically, there is a big difference between an aborted fetus, and a 4 day old embryo. Ethically, I believe both of them to be innocent life.
I just strongly believe that if we want our opinions to be respected, we should strive to be as credible as possible. This issue is not abortion, it is fetal stem cell research. The stem cells are harvested from embryos which have been created in a laboratory, and are 4 days old. Some have been frozen, and might remain frozen indefinately. Some are created specifically for this process. There is no pregnancy or abortion, but that does not mean this is ok.
Life begins at conception, and therefore these embryos are each an innocent human. They could be implanted, and produce a baby.
"Go figure" ping...
But we really shouldn't bicker between ourselves.
The debate should be directed at people such as Michael J. Fox, who is distorting the issue for political manipulation.
I think you misunderstood my point. I never attempted to lecture anyone. I just think that when discussing this issue, we have the opportunity to inform those that may not understand the issue completely. If they start reading about aborted fetuses, or pregnant wives, they will assume we know nothing about the issue, and ignore the discussion. Or they might assume we are dishonestly trying to tie this issue in with the abortion issue.
To me that represents a lost opportunity to convince others. I feel very strongly about protecting innocent life. I also believe that the best way to convince others is to research the issue thoroughly and to always try to provide accurate information in my arguments.
I think he is now a US citizen.
Thank you, Ladysmith. Rush really tore into this one today. You know, MJF is a talented, funny guy. It's a shame to see him become a pawn of the left. Yeesh. (He worked tirelessly on Kerry's campaign. Blech!)
That's alright. We've got BART STAR and LAURA BUSH fundraising for Mark Green and John Gard these last two weeks.
And in case ANYONE is confused, ESR is LEGAL in Wisconsin. The only issue is whether this research should be TAXPAYER FUNDED, something Mark Green is against. This commericial is filled with lies.
Oct 24, 2:01 PM EDT
Michael J. Fox praises Doyle over stem cell research in new ad
By RYAN J. FOLEY
Associated Press Writer
MADISON, WI (AP) -- Michael J. Fox praises Gov. Jim Doyle's support for stem cell research in a new campaign ad, saying medical cures from Wisconsin could help those suffering from disease such as himself.
The actor afflicted with Parkinson's disease puts a face on one of Doyle's top campaign themes, urging voters to re-elect the Democrat and painting Republican opponent U.S. Rep. Mark Green as a foe of research that could save lives.
"What you decide can affect millions of people - like me, like your family," says Fox, who looks directly into the camera as his head and body move as a result of his condition. "Please, re-elect Gov. Doyle. For all of us."
The ad is the third Fox has recorded on behalf of candidates who support embryonic stem cell research but the first in a governor's race, said John Rogers, a political adviser to Fox and leader of Stem Cell Champions for Doyle.
Green said the ad was another dishonest attack leveled against him by Doyle.
"His latest ad, which is part of a national smear campaign by Democrats, flat out lies about my record on stem cell research," Green said in a statement. "However, using a celebrity to further Jim Doyle's false attacks does not make them any more true."
The ad could appeal to moderate Republicans and independent voters who will determine the election, said Joe Heim, a professor of political science at University of Wisconsin-La Crosse. Green and Doyle are locked in a tight race.
"I'd say that ad packs an emotional punch," he said. "Having a Hollywood personality supporting a candidate in Wisconsin is unusual. It is going to get attention. Plus, he's a known character."
Fox is a leading supporter of research using embryonic stem cells, which hold great promise because they can grow into every type of cell in the human body. But some conservatives oppose the research because days-old human embryos are destroyed.
Research supporters say the embryos leftover at fertility clinics would be discarded anyway so it's justified to use them for research.
The issue has been prominent here because University of Wisconsin scientists have been pioneers in the field. In the ad, Fox says, "The cures we're looking for may come from here."
Green has supported President Bush's 2001 policy of restricting federal research funding to those stem cell lines already in existence. He voted this summer to uphold Bush's veto of a bill that would have expanded federal funding for the work.
Fox says Green's votes "have set us back."
Green noted that he supported federal funding for existing embryonic stem cell lines, including those discovered at UW-Madison.
Green also reiterated his plan to spend $25 million on a research technique in which the cells are extracted but embryos are left in tact. Green says the technology could remove the ethical concerns surrounding the research.
Doyle has strongly supported an expansion of embryonic stem cell research and promised to veto bills restricting it.
One of his achievements has been helping find state and private money for the Wisconsin Institutes for Discovery, research centers at UW-Madison. Fox appeared with Doyle in Madison last year to back those plans.
Doyle also vetoed a bill prohibiting scientists from cloning embryos for research purposes last year, saying it would hinder stem cell research. Green said he would have signed the bill approved by the Republican-controlled Legislature.
The 30-second Fox ad will hit the airwaves Wednesday in Milwaukee, Green Bay and Wausau, said Doyle campaign spokesman Anson Kaye.
Fox, known for his work on television shows "Family Ties" and "Spin City" and the "Back to the Future" movies, has also recorded ads for Democratic candidates for U.S. Senate in Missouri and Maryland.
"From Michael's perspective, he's a single issue kind of guy and that issue is stem cells," Rogers said. "Given the fact that this is a very much a focus on the campaign, he wanted to lend his support to the governor."
I guess I can understand why Michael J. Fox is taking the stand that he is. He has a horrible disease, and thinks that fetal stem cells are the cure. He has a right to his cause. I don't have Parkinson's and maybe if I did, I would see things differently.
My response to him would be that I completely understand his desire to change the political views on ESCs. I feel badly that he is suffering. I just don't agree that taking an innocent life, is an acceptable answer.
I strongly support other lines of research and I pray that a cure can be found. There are many people that die every day, while organ transplant lists. However, doctors and researchers cannot just find a donor, and murder them, so that the patient will get their organ and be cured. No life is more important than another.
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