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To: AtomicBuffaloWings
Yeah, that is the Second Coming.

Yes, it is; but it not also what is known as the Rapture?

332 posted on 09/14/2006 6:12:48 AM PDT by Elsie (Heck is where people, who don't believe in Gosh, think they are not going....)
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To: Elsie; andysandmikesmom
Ok, before I start of i just wanted to make clearer that I believe the Earth is billions of years old. And that I'm using KJV online text from Bible Gateway because KJV is the one I did my hilighting in and have in front of me. When I looked at 21st Century KJV on BG though, I see I should pick one up someday as it appears to make using a Strong's Expanded Red-Letter Concordance even easier.

1Thess4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 15For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.



The word prevent is already correctly translated in the 21st CenturyKJV as precede. In the concordance, prevent is 5348 and says it means beforehand or precede. Christians living on earth won't precede (going to heaven or rising up) those that have already died because Christ is bringing those that have already died with him from heaven (which is where they went when they died), at the Second Coming.

1Corinthians 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: 43It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power: 44It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

1Corinthians 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. 16And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,


The mystery in Corinthians is that Christians, possibly everybody living on earth when Christ returns for that matter, will not die. Our physical bodies will be changed or done away with in the twinkling of an eye. We'll be left with nothing but our souls and spiritual bodies. Those that sleep (died) have already changed so to speak. Their flesh and blood husk of a body truly died but they, their souls went to heaven.

The last trump, the 7th in Corinthians 15:52 sounds like it's the same trump being described in 1Thess 4:16.

Notice the Lord does not come back and make the the world His kingdom to rule and reign until the 7th angel has blown the last trump in Rev 11:15.

I am not sure what Arnold Murray believes on this next point, but I believe Christ rose after 3 days in a fully flesh and blood body. Thomas put his hands in his wounds. As Luke 24:22 shows-

Yea, and certain women also of our company made us astonished, which were early at the sepulchre; 23And when they found not his body, they came, saying, that they had also seen a vision of angels, which said that he was alive.

---there was NO body in the tomb. That proves his flesh and blood body rose. From some verses in Acts 13 I don't believe it ever saw any rot either. He was special.

I haven't even gotten to 2Thess. yet but I will. I know this is a lot to read and think over but I hope you both can make heads and tails of my post, thoughts and HTML formating of the Bible verses.

340 posted on 09/17/2006 5:04:49 PM PDT by AtomicBuffaloWings (Still not hot enough, A few of my taste buds are still alive.)
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