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People really CAN be trusted with the reins of government, self-rule and determination. But it's got to be the real deal, not a fait accompli by hucksters.

I agree with you on that. I just feel a need to challenge sound bites like the one that launched my original post. "An armed society is a polite society." That may very well be true, but I'd like a bit more justification than a jingle.

I cannot think of any society where the majority of adults are armed that proves that statement. Forty five million Americans (14%) own all 198 million guns so we're not an example. Japan allows no ownership and has one of the lowest crime rates on the planet. Iraq seems to have more arms than the United States military and maybe they say "I'm Sorry" before they shoot someone, but I still wouldn't call that polite.

I'm surrounded by and run with very responsible gun owners daily. I also read regularly here in FR, comments like "That robbery at McDonalds wouldn't have happened if someone in line had his Glock with him and put a cap in that guy's ass." Yeah, that's the ticket. Just what I want to see, a shootout at the Happy Meal corral.

I simply don't believe that an armed society causes a polite society. It's more likely a polite society can allow it's people to be armed.

For someone who supposedly has a family steeped in the firearms business, you could damn near write press releases for Josh Sugarman.

83 million gun owners last time I saw a decent stat on it and over 240 million guns. Japan may have a low gun crime rate, but suicide is through the roof and you still have the Yakuza running the underground. Iraq had millions of AK's laying around, but no basis for individual responsibility ingrained in them and rampant religion/government backed militia's.

And yes, there are news stories everyday (mostly ignored by the CNN crowd) where a single gun owner takes out a goblin BEFORE they can create more mayhem. I'd rather a gun owner shoot a goblin while ordering a Happy Meal than have to sit on my hands while said goblin shoots my family in the area Luby's cafe.

Iraq is still a lawless society. There aren't any police forces who have weeded out the bad guys yet.
During all of our history until the last century, a criminal who paid his debt to society had his guns returned. If he was a murderer, rapist and/or dangerous, he never made it out of the prison system alive. Today, dangerous criminals and mental patients are routinely freed from jails and hospitals.

Go to any gun range in the country or hunting camp. You can't find a more polite atmosphere.

It's more likely a polite society can allow it's people to be armed.

I have two comment on this, particularly since my original comments seem to have sparked this conversation to some extent.

1st, it is true that it is much more likely that a polite society is more capable of being responsibly armed. That is because a fundmental moral foundation is indidspensable to liberty and freedom. Our fouders knew this and our society and its government was based upon the notion that we were all created equal, that we were endowed with certain unalienable rights, and that the people, by and large in the large majority, were good.

2nd, I take issue with the statement about society allowing people to be armed. I believe it is a fundamental unalienable right. It is not for sociey to decide IMHO. I believe that the people being armed is another indispensable ingredient to true liberty so long as their is evil in the world. I also believe it is clear that the founders felt that "armed" meant the individual citizens having ready access to and ownership of the same individual arms that their enemy's soldiers had access to...but that is my opinion.

Anyhow, the two go hand in hand, fundamental moral foundation and self defense through owning and bearing weapons...in this day and age, firearms.

Again, just my thoughts on the matter.